Fat, Media

Miss Conduct Tackles Fatties on the Subway… So to Speak

‘Member when Boston Globe advice columnist Miss Conduct asked us for responses to some douche who wrote to her complaining about fat people who don’t have the decency to get thin before boarding public transportation? Well, her column about it is finally up, and as usual, she rocks.

A subway or bus token buys you the right to a ride, not to a seat or an enjoyable experience. As a short person, I don’t like having my face stuck in some basketball player’s armpit when I ride, but such is the case at times. As a person with a bad back, I don’t like having to get up and surrender my seat to an elderly person, but this happens, too. I don’t like hearing secondhand rap music from a neighbor’s ear buds or shrieking drunken dialogue, nor do I like smelling Axe body spray or last night’s Mad Dog 20/20. But when you take public transportation, you need to develop tolerance and detachment. If you can’t handle contact with the flesh of strangers, public transportation is not for you.

She’s also running reader responses, including some from Shapelings, on her blog. Go check it out!

(Registration may be required to read her stuff. Grrrrrr. Dear Miss Conduct, how can I tell my favorite newspapers that requiring registration is unbelievably irritating and outdated? Love, Kate.)

67 thoughts on “Miss Conduct Tackles Fatties on the Subway… So to Speak”

  1. I didn’t realize this was a big problem. I take public transit to and from work, and sometimes if I take days off during my workweek to do shopping.

    Let me tell you, there are a lot of fatties like myself riding the county bus (it’s a dollar to and from destinations so it’s a big benefit to the disabled, elderly, and people like myself who don’t own a car, and with gas so damn high, you do the math) and we have never been ridiculed for taking up space. And since a lot of us have to walk to and from the bus stops, we’re also getting that exercise that fat-haters insist we never do.

    Sorry, but I’m not going to give up public transit because I look like Halle Berry’s before picture. A lot of riders have worse habits than just having more meat on their bones.

  2. Kate–Thanks! Great headline. You now owe me a keyboard. (Sorry about the registration required. Sometimes it’s required, sometimes it doesn’t seem to be. No idea what’s up w/that.)

  3. I love Miss Conduct SO much.

    And random aside, Kate, but do you know about bug me not?
    I jump over there every time I’m asked to register. Love it too.

  4. “…how can I tell my favorite newspapers that requiring registration is unbelievably irritating and outdated?”


  5. I saw this in the Boston Globe yesterday and laughed out loud at her use of the phrase “being fat at us!” Go, Miss Conduct!

  6. Gah…airplanes now this? Sometimes I’m glad I live in a city with little public transportation. Then I weep for the environment.

    Great article though! Yay!

  7. I live in a big city, so occasionally I get the dirty look, etc. However, on pub trans, I’m the GIVER of dirty looks more often. I mean, I’ve endured all the ickies that Ms. Conduct mentions – ear buds too loud, arm pit funk, etc etc. So I, too, figure that its just pub trans and DEAL WITH IT.

  8. Nicely done Miss Conduct. Perhaps you should teach a workshop on how to approach weight issues sensitively and invite Ask Amy, Dear Abby and Dan Savage to attend.

    “…how can I tell my favorite newspapers that requiring registration is unbelievably irritating and outdated?”

    I agree that it is, too, but as a newspaper employee myself, I realize it helps pay the bills. Our newspaper is offered free online – so, why should anyone purchase a copy? Newspapers make money off ad revenues and print ads are much more profitable than online ads. Registration helps refine the demographic who are reading online so that we can tailor the online ads more to readers.

  9. I’m loving the phrase “being fat at us!” I need to start going up to my friends and saying “look! I’m being fat at you!”

  10. I love that phrase too, Charlotte :D And Miss Conduct nailed that one.

    I will say that I’ve never had the problem on NJ Transit trains, *but* they are not so crowded anyone has to stand either. There are usually never more than one person in the three-person seat (and usually they have a bag or something next to them to ward off having two more people sit there) so I take the third and it’s no fuss. Or I get a two-seater to myself. Either way there are usually extra seats, so I’ve had no problems. Yet.

  11. Speaking of Ask Amy, did you see her Feb 29 column? Long story short, coworkers were whinging about a woman bringing in sweets, claiming that she was trying to sabotage their diets because she is heavy and “misery loves company.” Amy replies that the dieters should sabotage back by bringing in fruit and veg. How wonderful that all the world’s problems can be solved with a bag of baby carrots and some grapes (frozen, so they’re like having a popsicle). Meh.

    Sorry, dunno how to do links:


  12. SjC that one makes me so mad I could spit. I am dying to fire off a scathing reply but I don’t see a comment button yet (lucky for her.) Now I was all happy about the Miss Conduct and there you had to go leave that awful thing lol. Sigh. Poor women, determined to stay hungry all the time and so hungry already that they can’t even bear the sight of food – “forbidden” food. That they hate their coworker for trying to be generous and kind. That they are *that* diet-obsessed.

    I felt that way on Jenny Craig – we had a bible study once a week and the hostess insisted on making sweet treats – but I was on Jenny Craig! I went so far as to tell her I thought she was trying to sabotage my diet. But I was very young then, and she was a kind person who realized I was just hungry and miserable. I would know better now, and this advice column asshat ought to know better too.

  13. Man, I wish I could get someone to “sabotage” me like that. Free fruit? Bring it on.

    But seriously, that attitude drives me crazy — it’s one thing to restrict your own behaviors, because it’s your body, but demanding that other people structure their use of public space around YOUR diet? Conceivable only to those who are struggling through malnourished brain-fog.

  14. I think it’s Meme Roth’s motivation. A world with no cupcakes, a world with no temptation.

  15. I lovelovelove the title of this one, and Miss Conduct!

    As for Ask Amy, three things: first, no one is force-feeding that gal anything. Second, there is ‘temptation’ everywhere; I somehow don’t think she’s asking the local gas station, for example, to stop selling chips and soda so she doesn’t have to look at them. No, she’s just targeting her fat coworker for being fat. Third, if no one ate the treats said coworker left out, and for that matter, thanked her for them, then I seriously doubt she would keep providing them. Projecting issues onto everyone else, much?

    Incidentally, this is llamas…I finally registered for an account, and it was taken.

  16. Are we out of line asking her to please “cool” it and quit bringing in junk food?

    Yes! Short of a deadly allergy, you have no right to dicatate which foods your coworker brings to work. If you’re so deprived of junk food that you literally can’t resist it, that’s really your problem, not your coworker’s.

    As for this:

    My friend thinks she is trying to sabotage others. She is quite heavy, and my grandmother used to tell me that “misery loves company.”

    How self absorbed can some people be? It’s not all about you. Probably, she just likes junkfood.

  17. Even though it’s good to continue to speak up when mainstream advice columnists give dumb advice, I really try not to put too much stock in them in general. Cary Tennis and Emily Yoffe (the latter wrote “Dear Margo” for a while) alone are living proof that you certainly don’t need to have your life together or have half a brain to write an advice column. You just have to know the right people, or maybe be the daughter of a dead famous advice columnist.

  18. Hoo boy. If the coworker were skinny, what are the odds she’d be “sabotaging everyone else because she wants to be the pretty one”?

    One of my favourite things about the place I work is that there’s almost always junk food and there are almost always oranges. Options! Yay!

  19. I somehow don’t think she’s asking the local gas station, for example, to stop selling chips and soda so she doesn’t have to look at them.

    Don’t you just bet that she would if she thought she could get away with it, though?

  20. If Ask Amy weren’t on the same page as the sudoku, I’d never give her a thought. For about an hour, I tried crafting a scathing response to Amy, but then I gave up. It’s like trying to talk to my acquaintance who thinks all food in a vending machine is from Teh Devil.

    My new project is trying to get someone at work to sabotage me with some good strawberries. These barely pink, styrofoamy, mid-winter little nasty fruits just aren’t cutting it for me. “Oh no, here are some fresh-baked cookies. You better get me on track with some beautiful fresh fruit. I may learn to be healthy quicker if you get me some nice tomatoes too.”

    Will sabotage diets for good produce

  21. SjC, that is a very good plan! I had some very disappointing strawberries today at work, and they just didn’t sabotage me adequately. But what I’d really like is some actual yummy watermelon sabotage.

    Don’t you just bet that she would if she thought she could get away with it, though?

    Of course! But geting laughed out of the gas station probably wouldn’t be as much fun as being self-righteous at someone being fat at her.

  22. I somehow don’t think she’s asking the local gas station, for example, to stop selling chips and soda so she doesn’t have to look at them.

    Don’t you just bet that she would if she thought she could get away with it, though?

    Well, I have heard of employees asking to have vending machines removed from the workplace. Which would make me so angry, because I need to eat a snack mid-afternoon or my blood sugar drops and I get really irritable and unable to concentrate on work. I try to bring something healthy from home, because eating potato chips or chocolate bars every afternoon would get old, but sometimes I forget or don’t have anything to bring. Why should somebody else’s inability to resist the vending machine affect my health and work productivity?

  23. I work in an office where nobody brings in sweets unless it’s for themselves, or it’s for holidays. Then usually we end up giving the stuff away to tenants in the apartment complex. As a matter of fact, there is a bag of Mike and Ike’s in the cupboard that have not been eaten in three months. We are not junkfood junkies at work, even me, the fattie.

    As for the people who think they’re being sabotaged, don’t worry about the fattie bringing in sweets. I sincerely doubt she’s trying to ruin diets. She probably doesn’t give a rat’s ass about who’s eating what and is trying to be nice. If they won’t eat it, I’m sure there are people who will.

  24. I was resisting until I saw the guy comparing the visible “junk food” to a celice. Then I lost it and fired off a response. lol – oh well. See, they keep TEMPTING me with all this stupidity and I *try* – oh I try so hard to resist and be good and not tell them how dumb they are, but…but it’s so tempting! I just end up making all these pissed off comments when I see blatant stupidity – whatever can I do to stop myself? :P

  25. Ah public transit…
    I dislike thinking “if public transit isn’t nice enough for you, drive”. This causes traffic problems, environmental problems, etc.
    Maybe someone should just concentrate on making public transit less sucky?
    Oh and could you skinny bitches please stop trying to sit between me and the fatty in the other seat on the 4-seaters? We sat down first. (Skinny does not equal bitch normally)

  26. Warning: This has nothing to do with the post at hand; I don’t know if you get notification of comments on old posts, so I’m putting this here just in case.

    So, now that I’ve established my boorishness… I was reading Kate’s entry about Old Navy’s decision to discontinue in-store plus sizes, and I was wondering if your mall has a store called Maurice’s. We have one here and they’ve always been my favorite store — when I could find something (usually an XL) that fit. They recently started stocking plus sizes, and they did it brilliantly — they devoted half the entire store to plus sizes, arranged and displayed exactly like the non-plus sizes. The clothes are cute as hell, the clothes are not hidden away in a tiny corner, they installed larger mannequins with actual breasts for display purposes, and they advertised. They advertised with a big ol’ “Hey, we now carry sizes 16-30!” sign in a pretty shade of pink with cool lettering. Furthermore, they hired some plus-size saleswomen who actually seem to know what the hell they’re doing. It is the most awesome thing ever. They have plus-size minidresses! Minidresses! As if… as if fat thighs are, in fact, perfectly fine to display, and possibly even sexy!

    Um, it’s awesome. And I thought it might make a nice alternative to Old Navy for Kate, or anyone else who needs one, if you/they haven’t already found one and need the assistance of a completely random Internet stranger. Yes. The end.

  27. I was resisting until I saw the guy comparing the visible “junk food” to a celice.

    Celice? The google did not help me here.

  28. I responded to this post, sniper, where he says: “Regarding LW2 who is sorely tried by the tempation of having to look at junk food, I have a suggestion for those who don’t understand the continual pain that it causes her.
    Get and wear a celice. If you don’t know what that is, check this link:
    That will help you learn what it is like to suffer continual discomfort all day. If you can’t tollerate a celice all day, then perhaps you’ll have more sympathy for LW2. ”

    In case the link doesn’t work, here it is again http://www.pubbys.com/davincianswers/What%20Is%20A%20Cilice.htm

    Like it’s the *other* woman’s fault that she’s on a diet! Like it’s anyone else’s responsibility to make her dieting painless – which is not possible anyway. Gah, that one just ticked me off. Plus he loses points for referring to the Da Vinci Code lol. (JMHO.)

  29. Oh, and like does this moron have any idea how many people live with *chronic pain* and how many of them are fat people? I know all about chronic pain thanks. As to purposely subjecting myself to it – I’ll pass.

  30. Celice? The google did not help me here.

    It’s a metal contraption that very religious folks used to wear (and some still do) that you bind tightly around a leg, an arm, etc. so that you can suffer as Christ suffered. To see one in action watch “The Davinci Code.”

    Personally, I think potato chips are a lot safer.

  31. Remember when giving people food used to be a nice gesture, where did that go?

    Dieters are out there deliberately trying to sabotage my attempts to eat in an ordered manner. Hey look, I can make everything all about me, too!

  32. GH, I have a neighbor who is on Weight Watchers (well – she attends meetings because she lost her daughter and she’s lonely but I’m pretty sure she doesn’t follow the diet) and every time I send her over a dessert or something delicious, she’s thrilled. Seriously. And wants the recipe lol. She says at her WW meetings that’s what they do – exchange recipes for desserts and fattening things. Not even in her imagination does she think of it in any terms other than a very nice thing to do. And that’s someone who goes to WW lol. It IS still a nice thing to do; even if you decide to pass and not eat it. Jeesh.

  33. And there is a lot of ass-backwardness to the whole “the fattie is all about the bad foooooood” thing, too. You know, maybe she really likes making yummy food, but has no desire to eat it all herself. So, you know, sharing happens. Some recipes you just can’t cut down to a personal size. I make a freakin’ killer three-layer chocolate cheesecake, but it’s a full-size cheesecake and I honestly don’t want to eat it all. It would make me really, really sick. And cheesecake doesn’t last more than a couple of days before it gets dry and weird. So once or twice a year when I feel like I absolutely have to make it, I take it in to work. Jeez, I had no idea that must make everyone hate me so much.

  34. Well, you know what would happen if the fat chick brought in a nice fruit salad instead of baked goods. “Oh, are you on a DIET? Yuk yuk yuk.”

    Truth of the matter is, when I worked in offices people brought in baked goods all the time and sometimes I would eat them and sometimes not, but when I didn’t it was because I wasn’t in the mood for them or they didn’t appeal to me, not because I was Trying To Be Goody Goody Good. And no matter what, I’d never, ever just polish off a whole pile of cookies — I’d take one, maybe two if they were really rockin’. That’s what can result from letting yourself eat what you really want — sometimes you legitimately really don’t want it even if it’s baaaaad.

  35. Car, me too.

    I love to bake, and I usually end up making way more cake/cookies/muffins/whatever than the Boy and I can eat, so I usually bring the leftovers to work. Until I read the Ask Amy column, I never even considered that anyone would be so self-obsessed that they’d interpret Sharn Bringing Cake as anything other than “Hey, Sharn brought cake! Awesome!”

  36. Both the article posted, and the article left in the comments just goes to show backwards it is in public.
    Not only are people throwing fits about the size of the person sitting next them, but people are now throwing fits about others bringing in food. I wish I had more to say, but I’ve just been left totally speechless…

  37. In one place I worked “Mrs. Millur brought cake” was secret code for “It is Mrs. Millur’s birthday”.

    Simple plan: show up with baked goods. People ask, “why are there baked goods”. Answer, “It’s my birthday”. People say, “happy birthday!”

    Everybody KNEW the plan, everybody FOLLOWED the plan. We had home-made treats about twice a month. I think it was in the training manual for the 4-month co-op students.

    Except for Linda and Brian* who had the same birthday, and brought in baked goods for each other. They cheated.

    *names changed cuz I worked there ages ago, and don’t remember their actual names.

  38. Remember when giving people food used to be a nice gesture, where did that go?

    I used to bring in home made muffins and cakes when I was working my student job in a lab (a psychology lab – so you are allowed to eat) – and the PhD students regularly put out sweets for us undergraduate “lab rats”. It was nice – I loved when people complimented my muffins, and I loved it that someone was thinking about sweetening those long lab afternoons for me.
    Also, I have been a vegetarian for about 14 years. During the first few years after going veg I still sometimes craved meat – and if there was meaty food around I did at times eat it. I wonder what people would have thought if I would have told them that they are trying to sabotage into eating meat.

  39. I have to admit, the response to Miss Conduct about how people don’t resent or give dirty looks to those on the subway or other forms of public transit with disabilities gave me pause. My partner is disabled, and at least twice bus drivers have stopped the bus, turned around, and insisted that if no one got up from the disabled seats to give the man with the cane and the very obvious physical disability a seat, the bus wasn’t moving. (Go bus driver!) He gets a lot of dirty looks, lots of sighs and rolling of eyes at having to omg give up a seat for the disabled guy. And this isn’t even getting into the stuff that happens when he’s in his wheelchair.

    I don’t want to say that people are just jerks, because I don’t like saying such things. That doesn’t mean it’s not true.

    [Which isn’t to say that people complaining about omg fatties on the subway aren’t in the wrong – they completely are.]

  40. SjC – I’d like to tell that “misery loves company” gal that food is a source of happiness for me. I like to eat, and I’m not ashamed of it. And I eat “junk” and “healthy” food.

    And another thing – why do dieters expect the WHOLE WORLD to change because they can’t eat “bad” foods anymore?

    I’m sorry, I hate nosy people. Mind your own damn business!

  41. Oh, and Kate? Kate Harding? You’ve been called a “fucking nutter” by some girl named Lori:

    “Oh, and that woman from Shapely Prose is a fucking nutter who routinely bitches about what people said that was mean about fat people, after misquoting them badly.”

    And then she referred people to that VA chick and Mr. Savage.


  42. Jesus, Sarah, that Lori person makes my head hurt. I’m really impressed by your measured and intelligent response.

  43. Lilah – it wasn’t my response. It was the blog owner – her name is Erin. I just left a snarky comment, as usual.

  44. Ah, thanks for correcting me on that, Sarah! (I see bullshit “evolutionary biology” explanations about how we all “evolved” to be exactly the thing the commentor wants us to be and I start seeing red and lose my ability to, like, read coherently. :-))

  45. I’m twitching. Between the people pissed about baked goods, do I have to stop baking for my neighbors now? I mean are Christmas cookies out of bounds? What about when I make barbeque and huge meals for my family and share with the people living on either side of me? Am I sabotaging them too?

    God…one of my ‘love languages’ is making food for people. If you’re sick and I love you I come over with chicken noodle soup and lemon poppy seed muffins. If you come over for dinner I roast a chicken or make a from scratch meat sauce. I make a scary amount of cookies and treats around holidays and pass them out. I’m not trying to get anyone fat, I’m just trying to bring them joy and happiness. I love giving people things that I have made with my hands that taste good. To me that’s showing how much I care, that I went through the time and effort to make something for them.

    I also knit and crochet, and give out hats, scarves, blankets, socks and the like. For me it’s all about the making from -my- hands and giving to them. Food, craft objects, those things are not calories or yarn dollars it’s all about me spending time on doing something personal for you.

    Now I am going to wonder when I do something like that for someone new if they are going to resent my efforts. Sigh.

    As for that Lori person, I have no words..I’ll leave it to someone more clever.

  46. Hi guys! Short term lurker, first time poster. I’m loving this site, and all the other blogs I’ve found dealing with size issues.

    I despise people with no willpower, who want to blame others for their inability to resist treats. I baked the cookies, I did not shove them down your throat. Have some personal responsibility. It’s worse in an office of women, I’ve found. Now, I work in a warehouse full of guys, who are so appreciative when I bake them treats.

    It’s so nice to be thanked by people who (admittedly, don’t care about their waistlines) like my treats than to be moaned at about how many calories are in a cookie.

    Kate – I do love your blog. You make some very good points, but I do disagree with you on some issues. However, I will do so politely and respectfully, because I think you’re performing a great service here.

  47. Magnolia, keep on doing what you’re doing! Breaking bread with strangers is a sign of hospitality pretty much everywhere outside of fucked-up western society. I’m Jewish and, even though I’m non-practicing, the cultural aspect of showing love by cooking for friends and relatives, is very much a part of who I am too. Fortunately I don’t hang out with many dieters these days so no one is offended by my cooking.

    Lori bears a striking resemblance to a variety of orthorexic concern trolls I’ve had the misfortune to lock verbal horns with in the past. (Don’t you just love it when they start blathering on about evolution and ancient civilisations? Hello? The Willendorf Venus ain’t hourglass-shaped).

    If she didn’t feel threatened by FA at some level she wouldn’t be throwing insults while accusing us of nefarious cultish conspiracy. (“That’s what the FA movement wants you to think with their evil mind control mwahahaha!”)
    Plus, is it just me or does she appear to be allowing her all-knowing doctor to micromanage her life rather more than most supposedly healthy people?

  48. You know where that 0.7 number came from? Comparing past and present Miss America contest winners to past and present Playboy centerfolds. This was supposed to prove that all men across all times and cultures have found women with a 0.7 waist to hip ratio sexy. (And what men find sexy is of course supposed to automatically represent health and fertility). And furthermore, the study wasn’t even very accurate.

    God, I hate evo-psych.

  49. And right on cue, this just happened IN MY OFFICE:

    Friend stops by, has good Italian cookies given to her by a co-worker because it’s her birthday. She wants to share. I take a cookie.

    Other co-worker comes in, sees us eating cookies. Friend with birthday offers her one. She refuses with “No, look at my belly!” with a pointed squeeze at the offending area.

    Yes, thank you for the pointed jab at both me and the person whose fucking birthday it is today. Sheesh. It’s a cookie. It won’t make you gain 10 pounds all by itself. That’s fine if she doesn’t want to eat one, but come on. Don’t be rude about it.

  50. If it’s really a 0.7 WHR that men are supposed to find enticing, why aren’t more women getting ass implants instead of breast implants? Just wonderin’.

  51. Seriously, car, what’s wrong with, “No, thanks”? It’s food, not crystal frigging meth. It’s perfectly benign and perfectly legal for whoever wants to to eat it unless there’s a legitimate safety reason for their not being able to do so right then and there. And you’re allowed to not eat, too, if you don’t want it. Just say, “No, thanks,” and if you pretty reliably say “no, thanks,” when such things are offered, eventually people will get the hint and stop offering them to you. (Mind you, that train runs on both tracks; if someone says, “No, thanks,” move the hell on and don’t bug them about it. Fair is fair.)

  52. OMG, I just read that post and it seriously gave me a headache. It’s people like Lori, with absolutely no understanding of what evolution is and how it works, yet persist in presenting a warped image of it to support her viewpoints (read: prejudices) who give it such a bad name. People “evolved” to be 10-20 lbs overweight? There’s so many problems with that statement I don’t know where to begin, including the fact that we still have gaps in our knowledge of human evolution (because it’s so recent, the fossil record is spotty, and the population expanded so rapidly and recently that genetic analyses aren’t terribly informative). Even if you take that statement at face value, how can it be called “OVERweight” if you’ve evolved to be at that weight?

  53. I can’t help but laugh at that Ask Amy thing… because what’s going on IS a case of “misery loves company.” Some people who are voluntarily depriving themselves of what they really want to eat can’t stand seeing other people actually enjoying food.

  54. Boy, Lori sure is dumb. Her theory is so full of holes her brain probably looks like a Scotch Brite sponge.

    And shame on Yvonne for falling back on that tiresome “OMG, look at what that fatty eats, she’s so disgusting!” Because y’know, it’s okay to be fat if you don’t eat brownies and McDonald’s.

  55. Somebody needs to tell Lori that Kate Harding rocks. End of story!

    Sarah (I had a WordPress account all along!)

  56. Ugh. Evolution is the bane of my existence as an anthropologist. All it really means is that things change over time. Survival of the fittest just means that the ancestors of current generations were better at producing viable offspring than their contemporaries who don’t have any descendants. “Evolution” is not a deliberate process which results in an ideal state, it’s just a way of describing what happened.

    @kira–excellent point, by the way. How can a supposedly ideal weight be described as overweight? That doesn’t make any sense. What’s the baseline–your skeleton?

  57. “Evolution” is not a deliberate process which results in an ideal state, it’s just a way of describing what happened.

    Yes – the way a lot of these evolutionary psych types describe evolution, it’s a lot closer to creationism, isn’t it? A creation story that supports their particular moral beliefs, whatever those may be.

    How can a supposedly ideal weight be described as overweight? That doesn’t make any sense. What’s the baseline–your skeleton?

    I think that’s exactly what it is, since she seems to think that only 10%-20% body fat is appropriate for women (as it’s apparently the evolution-mandated amount).

  58. RE: The stupidity of Ask Amy

    I worked in an office where people brought in sweets all the time. When they asked me if I wanted one when I didn’t want one, I said “No, thank you.” Really, it’s as easy as that. If your whole diet plan is sabotaged by someone having a jar of candy on their desk, I think you probably have some emotional or disordered eating that ought to be addressed by a specialist, not WW.

  59. You know where that 0.7 number came from? Comparing past and present Miss America contest winners to past and present Playboy centerfolds. This was supposed to prove that all men across all times and cultures have found women with a 0.7 waist to hip ratio sexy.

    Because Playboy and Miss America have been around SINCE THE BEGINNING OF TIME.

  60. Dieters are out there deliberately trying to sabotage my attempts to eat in an ordered manner. Hey look, I can make everything all about me, too!

    “Your diet-oriented hissy-fit is sabotaging my intuitive eating. So no, I can’t stop bringing in food. Check and mate!”

    …is the proper response to Whiny Dieter.

  61. I’m really torn about the bringing in sweets issue. I’m sitting at a computer at my sister’s house and 8 feet from me is a plate of high-fat brownies. At my own house I make low-fat, high-protein brownies, and I eat them. I miss chocolate, and these brownies are the first source I’ve had in about a week. There is hot chocolate in the pantry, and I am a grown person who can make choices, but: But I eat better when I have healthier choices for my chocolates, fat, carbs. Work is different because it’s not feeling trapped in someone else’s food environment.

    Still, if food is your “love language”, a part of me wants to politely ask you to grow up. If you’re able to give people food without caring that they immediately put it in the trash, and if you tell them that, that’s another matter. I was raised around very poor people, and giving me food or clothes that I don’t want creates a chore for me of figuring out someone who does want those things. I am not a baby that needs to be dressed or fed. I am a human being that needs attention and affection, however – a compliment, a conversation about me or my interests. Food or other gifts that you know I will appreciate are also good, but I suspect conversations will be necessary to make that happen.

    This is coming out way snarkier than I mean it to be, because, duh, don’t look a gift horse in the mouth and all that. If you give me sweets I will smile and say thank you and put them in the freezer and eat them occasionally and think of you. If I know you well enough, I might say “no thank you I’m still working on the batch from last month”. I am not going to throw them in the trash, nor am I going to give them to someone else as soon as your back is turned because I think those things are rude. That said, people who insist on giving me gifts that I “obviously” don’t want – clothes that fit the giver’s sense of style more than mine, or food – seems to be to have something else going on. Are they lonely or controlling? I don’t know the psychology in that situation, but haven’t we all been given gifts that are really back-handed compliments?

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