I put together a slideshow to demonstrate just how ridiculous the BMI standards are.
There’s also a Flickr set with a bunch more photos.
Please note: submissions are now closed (but maybe not permanently).
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Notes from the Fatosphere-
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This work by Kate Harding is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-Noncommercial-No Derivative Works 3.0 License.
Wow! This is great.
And Moxie is so cute.
Just so you know, the show reads “Robin is morbidy obese”…
Joie, Robin is “morbidly obese.” (If you’re joking and that’s your point, ha!) Robin’s 5′10″ and 302 lbs., with a BMI of 43.3.
I’m just saying that while she may be morbidLy obese, no one is morbidy obese. As far as I know, at any rate.
Oh, DUH!
I used to get paid to catch that shit! Thanks, Joie!
This looks awesome. I’m glad you put this as a permanent feature.
Damn, that was jarring to start it up and see my own face staring back at me in the first picture.
Seriously educational. Goes to show exactly how useful the BMI metrics are…
I’ve just been reading Amanda’s blog, and I find it interesting that at least two of our “underweight” participants have chronic health problems.
powerful stuff. bravo!
Well done!
Looking at those pictures, it seems like
BMI under 20 = underweight
BMI 20-40 = normal weight
BMI 40+ = overweight
might be a better set of guidelines. Funny how that’s also the way the life expectancy data pans out…
On the other hand, putting people into any weight or BMI categories probably does more harm than good.
Yeah, I was underweight til about 19, when I got on a pain medication that increases appetite. I’m more padded now (I’m on the Flickr group at my current weight) and much, much happier that way.
I never did figure out what caused the underweight thing (even my doctors noted I seemed malnourished but never did anything about it) but it definitely seemed at least in part connected to the chronic health issues.
That’s amazing. I can tell no difference between normal and overweight in most cases. Hmm.
THANK YOU for showing the full range of real, beautiful women (and cats). Women are human beings, not numbers on a scale.
How dreary, and possibly unhealthy, the world would be if every single person fell within ‘normal’ BMI.
(even my doctors noted I seemed malnourished but never did anything about it)
Yeah, I was wondering whether you had a hard time getting adequate treatment because hey, at least you were thin. I think the medical ignorance knife cuts both ways on that one…
I love all these pictures. Moxie could be my Binkley’s cousin!
If you could still use more, I might have one I can send you.
I was sent here by Swistle, and as a MOm who gained a ton of weight breastfeeding my son, I now strive to be overweight. Sad hey, I think the “overweight” girls are what I am striving to be, not the “normal” ones. Someone feed the normal girls a donut! :)
Awesome slideshow.
Someone feed the normal girls a donut!
Sleepynita, Kate mentioned on the original post that there will be no critiquing of participants’ bodies for any reason. It bears repeating here. I’m glad you enjoyed the project, but please keep in mind that the people who submitted their pictures are overwhelmingly happy, satisfied, active people who are rocking the body shape that’s right for them. The women and men with BMIs 25 and under don’t need a donut (or fancy cheeses) any more than I need to lay off them.
Thanks, Fillyjonk.
The normal girls are indeed normal for them. And those of us who aren’t “normal” are normal for us. That’s the point. :)
This is of course not to say that they can’t have a donut if they want one!
NO DONUTZ! THEY GIVE YOU TEH FAT!
Love it, love it, love it. What a celebration of beautiful bodies.
I need to get off my duff and send a pic in.
Hooray, I’m part of the slideshow!
Something that I find very strange about the BMI classifications is that there is only one kind of “underweight” but then there’s “overweight”, “obese” and “morbidly obese” for the fatties. With all the concern about eating disorders and crazy extreme diets and ZOMG SCARY SKINNY!!!!!11one celebrities, you’d think there’d be more than just one level of skinny.
This was beautiful..thank you for putting it together.
As a “voluptuous” woman, (who works out regularly and eats better than 90% of the people I know, it is genetics) with a teenage daughter with the same genetics, I work hard to help her accept and love her curves..I just sent her a link to this and hope she fwds it on. and for the record, I am obese. when I did starve myself to a point of being “overweight” I was not healthy for my body type. now I focus on healthy food, healthy lifestyle, and work to love who I am.
Women’s bodies rock, all shapes and sizes, truly.
There aren’t many levels of skinny, really. There’s supposedly-”normal” skinny, there’s “you’re obviously having some sort of health problem” skinny, and then there’s “days from death” skinny. I guess they figure they don’t need to come up with a name for that last one.
The problem isn’t so much that there’s not enough categorizations left of the midpoint, the problem is that the midpoint is way left of where it would be, if it ought to be anywhere at all.
That was so fun. I loved seeing all of those women just… being.
If I had a recent body shot I’d send it. I’m “normal” – internet BMI 22, which I’m not sure how much to trust – and I’m definitely bigger than some of those “overweight” women.
I should add “…and men.” I enjoyed seeing them too, and I applaud them for participating.
Gorgeous. Really enlightening.
This reminds me of how ridiculous it is that I always choose the picture of myself that doesn’t show my chin or the photos that don’t show my wide hips or the photo that etc….. I am a senior in college and all of the students at my school are required to take a class called Heath Promotion 200. Everyone in the class is supposed to take the BMI, (what to we referred to in middle school as “the fat test” ). I am glad the teacher is allowing us to do an alternate assignment if we talk to him about it. That was not the case in middle school…
When I was in middle school they made us take the “fat test” in front of the whole class, it was one of the most embarrassing moments in my life. When I first learned that this was a legitimate ‘test’ I was mortified by it and then tortured with it for three years.
I also started to doubt the test because on of the girls who was larger than me, but extremely physically active did worse on the test than me. (she was the only one who failed the test worse than me, this is how I truly felt).
Writing about it now is strange because it makes me think of all of the horrors of middle school gym class. When they did the “fat test”, they also made us do the pull-up, or multiple pull-ups if you were “good”. If we couldn’t do any pull-ups, we were made to hang there in front of a bunch of people.
Spot on, Beth. Am I the only one who remembers middle school gym class as being explicitly designed to make you hate both exercise and yourself? They made us do 30 minutes of laps around (I kid you not) ONE TENNIS COURT. That’s like doing laps in the bathtub, only with less interesting scenery. How could anyone NOT hate running after that? And making us do “pull ups” (HA!) one at a time in front of each other. That’s like one pull-up every three days for each individual kid. How, exactly, does that build arm strength?
And people say that we need more of this bullshit to STOP TEH OBESITY EPIDEMIC ZOMG! Yeah…running in little tiny circles and watching other people fail at pull-ups will work WAY better than actual intersting sports and not hating yourself. It’s the Super Grover approach: “When in trouble or in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout!”
It is snowy here in the winter and they also made us “cross country ski” and snow shoe around the track behind the school, yeah real fun when you can see the woods where it would be so ‘dangerous’ to cross country ski…
Gym class felt like torture, that might be an interesting post.
“What are your BMI horror stories of gym class?”
Beth, we did the pull-ups in my middle school and I could only just hang there. One day a boy from another class came up and pulled my feet. I bicycled my legs to stay up, and he kicked me in the stomach. I stood up to hit him, and he punched my glasses off of my face.
At least he gave me some exercise.
Fuck middle school gym.
Thank you for this point of view. I personally have a bias against fat people. I think excessive fat looks gross. This entire site was very helpful for me to learn, not to let my bias prejudice how I view other wise normal and healthy people. Thank You!
I’m…. I’m not sure if that was a troll or not.
Just in case it wasn’t a troll: kevin, since you’ve started thinking outside the box, think a bit further. There’s no call to be prejudiced against people who aren’t healthy, either. No matter how much space they take up or how aesthetically unappealing you think they are.
The more I look at this project, the more I realize two things:
1. The BMI’s “normal” category is such a thin slice of the range of possible healthy body sizes that to land in it at all, much less because it’s your body’s natural happy equilibrium, is about as easy as winning the lottery.
2. All the women in the “overweight” range and about half in the “obese” range look to me like they should be labeled “normal.”
And middle-school gym class…agh, don’t remind me! I couldn’t do a pull-up, touch my own toes, and I took longer than anyone to run a mile…by about five minutes. Thank God it’s over!
Kevin: if you’re not a troll, then imagine replacing your words “fat” and “excessive fat” with any of the following:
female, breasts and hips
black, brown skin
disabled, wheelchairs
old, white hair
poor, off-brand clothing
Fear/hatred of fat people, like other forms of prejudice, is not *just* a personal bias, but an entrenched social phenomenon that damages many people’s lives. I hope, as lauredhel suggests, that you continue to think further.
1. The BMI’s “normal” category is such a thin slice of the range of possible healthy body sizes that to land in it at all, much less because it’s your body’s natural happy equilibrium, is about as easy as winning the lottery.
2. All the women in the “overweight” range and about half in the “obese” range look to me like they should be labeled “normal.”
Yep, Dani!
And even when you get beyond what looks “normal” to the average person, people still underestimate the classifications. I’ve heard “You’re just a little overweight; it’s not like you’re obese” more times than I can count. Well, the government disagrees!
Also, as I mentioned on Shakesville, there was a study last year that showed some ridiculous percentage of “obese” people didn’t know they were “obese.” William Saletan wrote about it at Slate, and of course it was, “Fatties are delusional! They’re in denial! THEY DON’T KNOW THEY’RE FAT!” But all the study was really asking was whether people knew their own BMI categories. So a lot of “obese” people pegged themselves as overweight and “overweight” people pegged themselves as normal. Looking at these pics, you can see exactly why that would happen, no delusion necessary.
But it’s a much better story if it suggests that fat people are fucking idiots, of course.
“But it’s a much better story if it suggests that fat people are fucking idiots, of course.”
Oh, of course. All the alternate headlines were total flops:
Fat People As Aware of Own Health As Anyone Else, Thanks
Fat People: Not As Fat As Government Says They Are
Study Shows BMI Accurate Indicator Of…Well, Nothing Really
No, Really, That’s What Women Are Supposed To Look Like
Dani, bwah!
Well, Jezebel.com just mentioned your BMI project. Wooooo!
First: Donuts…mmmmmm…*homer simpson gargle*
Second: Am I the only one who had a hard time distinguishing between normal, obese, and morbidly obese? Because, seriously, everyone looked spectacular!
Third: Gym Class. gag.
Well, Jezebel.com just mentioned your BMI project. Wooooo!
Wow, it only took nine comments for someone to say that Laurie was lying about her weight and was 110 max.
Wow, it only took nine comments for someone to say that Laurie was lying about her weight and was 110 max.
Oh, JESUS FUCKING CHRIST.
Oh, and it took a few more before someone said, “There’s no way you can be 325 lbs. and a triathlete.”
Uh, okay, then. Sorry, Sarah! You don’t exist!
[...] Harding has put together a slideshow illustrating how ridiculous BMI standards are. The show includes everyone from the underweight to the morbidly obese, and a lot of you might be [...]
Sarah’s also apparently doing irreparable damage to her joints, according to many people who are CERTAINLY doctors. This makes me lol particularly because a teeny friend of mine who’s maybe 120 max just started running and benched herself with an ankle injury almost immediately. Must be all that… fat?
Sarah’s also apparently doing irreparable damage to her joints
Its interesting to see how utterly useless chemistry-based medicine is, when it comes to joints and connective tissue.
fillyjonk – I saw that and laughed. My grandmother, who was well over 300 pounds herself, did have impressive (and irreparable) knee damage near the end of her life…her doctors said it was the result of years of *not* moving.
The funny part is, over at Jezebel, a lot of the eruption of comments is about how “well the BMI doesn’t measure muscle” or “I think a lot of those ‘overweight’ women look just fine” or whatever. Which are all semi-valid points, but seem to miss what, to me, is the major point: all of these people are humans, real people, not headless fat people on a 30-second newsreel or scary-sounding numbers on a chart. We’re all real people, EVEN THE MORBIDLY OBESE ONES LIKE ME, and dang, stop the hate already. For yourself and for everyone.
Amazing how people are still stuck on judging who is ‘acceptable’ and ‘not acceptable,’ just maybe by using a slightly different yardstick (one which, coincidentally, manages to include the measurer in the ‘acceptable’ category.) We’re all acceptable. Fat or not, health problems or not. Because since when did anyone get the authority to become The Body Police? Jesus.
Will you be adding more pictures to the project? My husband and I would love to get in on this. :)
Sure, Jeni! Send pics to katesblog at gmail.
all of these people are humans, real people, not headless fat people on a 30-second newsreel or scary-sounding numbers on a chart.
SM and I are headless though. Sorry everyone!
But yeah, I was struck by how many people at Jezebel used the project to beat up on themselves — like “these girls are ‘overweight’ and they still look better than me” or “wow, turns out I’m overweight, guess I’d better go punish myself.” Not that it’s really news to me that desperately unhappy women read publications like Jezebel, mind you.
[...] of Shapely Prose put together a Flickr slideshow illustrating the difference between underweight, normal, overweight and obese according to BMI [...]
“What are your BMI horror stories of gym class?”
Well, the caliper test in 8th grade really bugged me, but wasn’t as bad as it could have been, because we didn’t get to it until after I’d broken my leg falling down some stairs.
This is relevant because at 14, I was about 200lbs and 5′6″ and I was told by the orthoped that I really broke my leg because I WAS TEH FAT and IT WAS CRUSHING MY BONES and I MUST LOSE ALL THE LARD IMMEDIATELYY !!!111!! Oh, and btw, it might also be because my bone density was affected by lactose intolerance and I might want to quit drinking milk and take some mineral supplements. BUT IT WAS MORE LIEKLY TEH FAT!!!111!! He actually suggested I crash diet while I was in the cast to “get a head start.”
So by the time I got to the dreaded caliper test a month later, I was already hating myself and it just confirmed how horrible I was. My gym teacher was ok, but totally bought into the whole thin=good, fat=bad thing.
However, I moved, and my HS gym teacher was a tiny, aggressively feminist lesbian who didn’t care if any of us were fat – she mentioned the caliper thing but pointed out that she thought it was huge crock as fat has nothing to do with fitness. Her big thing was making sure we knew we could do as much as the boys, and that sports were good, and fun. She even flouted the rule girls weren’t allowed to particiapte in contact sports. Way more fun.
Anyway I think she planted he seed that health, strength and fitness are more important than anything else in my head. Good gym teachers can change lives. :)
Gym class was a nightmare from the word go. I had years of physical ability shaming, as a lifelong fat kid–like the time we had to run a mile in the field behind the junior high school and I walked it, because running was and is uncomfortable and something I’d been laughed at for doing. It took 20 minutes for me to walk a mile, everyone else was long since finished, and the gym teacher was screaming at me from the doorway to hurry up because she was sick of waiting for me. Anyway, once in high school we were being made to do the step test for the Presidential Physical Fitness Award thing (gah). The step test, if you don’t know, is having to step up onto the bottom row of the bleachers and then down again until you feel like dying. The teachers were walking along the row behind us as we stepped up and down, “encouraging” us, and I didn’t want to be ridiculed for not being able to hack it. So of course I pushed myself to the point of exhaustion–and I fell. I had weak ankles anyway from ice skating injuries and being so tired, my foot landed wrong, and I just went down. My mother had to come and pick me up and take me to the ER to get an x-ray. Luckily I didn’t break my ankle, just sprained it really badly.
But on top of all the fat-hating, it’s just awful that physical activity is presented to us when we’re young and impressionable as something that’s about being tough and hard and not being weak or giving in to pain or tiredness. Gym class was like boot camp, I swear, and the other kids were allowed to treat the clumsy and unfit among us like shit–though of course us braniacs were soundly rebuked should we pick on any of the jocks for being stupid because “they can’t help it.” School sucked.
But on top of all the fat-hating, it’s just awful that physical activity is presented to us when we’re young and impressionable as something that’s about being tough and hard and not being weak or giving in to pain or tiredness.
OMG, yes! No wonder I didn’t discover I actually liked exercise until I was in college! And when I started doing yoga and learned that PAIN MEANS YOU’RE DOING IT WRONG? A whole new world opened up.
Yeah, I have to wonder how many people Jane Fonda managed to turn off exercise, especially people who were in their teens and 20s in the early 1980s.
I wonder how many people got turned off from exercise by gym teachers. I know that was the case for me–in elementary school, I was made fun of in front of the entire class by the gym teacher. And he was not a small man himself. Junior high, the gym teacher (a female) was possessed with me losing weight, trying to force me to weigh in every day and keep a food diary. I finally told my mom about it and she went screeching in there to tell this woman to back off. My doctor got me excused out of gym class until my senior year, when I was recruited to be a part of a new class…Weight Management. Though I have to say it was probably the closest thing to HAES I’d experienced before I knew what HAES was. It was run by the first gym teacher I’d ever known that wasn’t a raving psychopath, and it wasn’t a horrible experience.
I absolutely love the slideshow/Flickr. I’ve paged through the photos again and again, marveling at the fascinating variety of people and shapes.
This slideshow is great. I thought I had pretty much adjusted my own perception of how fat people are based on the wildly innacurate (and sometimes hilarious) guesses people make about how fat/what size I am. And it’s true–when guessing weight, I come a *lot* closer than most people. However, I wasn’t thinking carefully enough with a friend the other day, and asked her if she was a size 12. She told me, with a slightly incredulous look, that she was a size 18. And I did a double-take, and thought, “Oh. Yeah. I guess I should have known that.”
And I *still* get comments from people about how I “can’t be that fat” when I tell them I weight 270 pounds or wear a size 20.
I’d be curious, actually, to see a sort of “sliding scale” (pun intended), of people of all shapes and sizes, arranged by weight. Or by height. Either one would be pretty awesome.
So you have people who weight 140-150 pounds, and within that category you have a whole bunch of people who all look very different from one another. Short, tall, skinny, fat…
I thought I had pretty much adjusted my own perception of how fat people are based on the wildly innacurate (and sometimes hilarious) guesses people make about how fat/what size I am.
You never know when the conditioning is going to rear its head, though. Yesterday, I heard from a friend from grad school I’d lost touch with, ’cause she found me via Jezebel. She told me she loved the project, and she’s a hair shy of “overweight,” at 5′8″ and 160 lbs.
My gut reaction: YOU weigh 160 lbs.?
Yeah, at fucking 5′8″. Which I know is the farthest thing from fat. But because I know her and have her in the “thin person” box in my mind, hearing that number blew my mind. Because of course all thin women weigh under 120, and all women who weigh over 150 are fat.
You’d think I, of all people, would not still have thoughts like that. But there it was.
I also ran a 20 minute mile — all three times we were made to run it. Fortunately I had a somewhat understanding teacher.
I was (as shown) uber skinny, but even I thought I was fat. How my thighs showed in gym shorts, O NOES! Yeah. And I remember running laps. In some cases, I would come in far last, with, of course, a couple of the fat kids. And the teacher would get on their case, but not mine. And I always thought, you know what, that’s bullcrap. They’re having a hard time physically too, why do they get criticized for it as though it’s just because they’re FAT! ? And even if it is, so fucking what?
It always annoyed me.
… and in the other case of running laps, I would actually come in as one of the first, because I was one of the only ones who actually tried. I had a couple of gym classes with the kinds of kids who would walk across the shallow end of the pool when we were supposed to be swimming laps. Damn straight I was graded well for my effort, even if my actual performance sucked, because I was putting in a thousand times more effort than they were. Ugh, that always annoyed the piss out of me.
Because of course all thin women weigh under 120, and all women who weigh over 150 are fat.
My standards, growing up, were a little more lax. Anything under 150 was skinny and desireable. Anything under 200 was acceptable. Anything above that meant the person had eaten one too many chocolate cakes. (Like me.)
Thank God my mother didn’t *try* to include me in her neuroses regarding weight. I picked up enough of it as it was–but at least I had the idea that fat people were still people, and that models were still WAY too skinny.
I’m still confused as to how I missed all that “I’m-supposed-to-look-like-a-model crap.”
Jane, your experience in gym is one of the reasons I am motivated to do activism (however, that winds up being). I don’t know how I lucked out, but I had sane coaches & teachers in PE all through school (and I was the “second fattest girl” in my town, as the bullies made sure I knew). I know so many people my size and smaller who were put through hell by sociopath gym teachers. That level of abuse is just… ARGGGGGG!!!!
I’m sending you the psychic equivalent of wicked cool magic playballs that have nothing but happy attached to them!!!
Oh my goodness, my picture has been viewed 10,748 times! That is crazy, I had no idea this would become this big.
“Amazing how people are still stuck on judging who is ‘acceptable’ and ‘not acceptable,’ just maybe by using a slightly different yardstick (one which, coincidentally, manages to include the measurer in the ‘acceptable’ category.”
Star-bellied Sneetches. Everything I needed to know about human nature I learned from Dr. Seuss.
Amy, did you go to my school?
Kate, d00dette, awesome Crane Pose. (Hopefully commenting on ostensible athletic ability is OK.) Although I do a wicked Twisted Root, me attempting Crane Pose (5′7″, short waist, long legs; high center of gravity for a girl apparently) looks an awful lot like Laurel & Hardy attempting “Swan Lake.” I over-rotated and sprained my wrist trying it once.
But awareness of what one’s body can actually do is key — which I think is part of the point here.
[...] Project: Eye opening look at the BMI scale BMI Project Shapely Prose Came across this today. Puts some new perspective into the mix, huh? __________________ Katie ~ [...]
haha, moxie. I’m so glad I stumbled onto this slideshow, I love this slideshow!
and redundancy.
When my mom was “morbidly obese”, she married a man 11 years her junior, whom I met in college!
When she finally starved herself down to a “normal” weight, at the urging of her doctors, her hair fell out and her teeth were loose. She also developed NALD (non alcoholic liver disease) from losing weight too fast.
I’m 5′2″, 225 lbs. I hike, dance, swim. I’m dating three men who think I’m incredibly hot, and two of my ex-boyfriends are still begging me to marry them.
Not only is weight not the only factor in “healthy”, it certainly isn’t the only factor in “sexy”.
Thank you SO MUCH for this. I have been having this argument with the doctor, and others, for awhile now and have been feeling at the end of my rope. I cannot qualify for a breast reduction until my BMI reaches 27– period. I’ve been trying to explain to people that BMI measurements are bullshit, and this slideshow proves it. Again, thank you.
Gertie, assuming that means you have to lose weight to qualify, that fucking ENRAGES ME.
First of all, when I got down to a size 4, I was still a DD. I had started out as a DDD, so for me, 65 lbs. = one cup size down. Not everyone who loses weight loses boob.
And when I was a size 4 and a DD? The boobs were still way out of proportion to my body, as you can imagine — and if I hadn’t been young at the time, they would have been causing back pain just as they do now.
Second, since we know virtually ALL dieters regain every pound lost, wouldn’t it make a hell of a lot more sense to operate on someone while her weight is stable, to reduce the risk that she’ll just gain weight and end up with overlarge breasts again anyway? I mean, I suppose if you’re a heartless, money-driven plastic surgeon thinking, “Hey, maybe I’ll get to operate on her AGAIN down the line!” then such a sensible course of action wouldn’t be in your best interest. But if you care about the best interest of the patient? Much better to do the breast reduction while she is in the weight range she will probably be in for the rest of her life.
Third, the reason women seek out breast reductions is usually that they are in pain. So once again we have an example of doctors saying, “We will not give you treatment for your PAIN until you lose weight.”
GRRRRRRR.
Aye, I have huge boobage that is painful. NHS (National Health here in Scotland) won’t operate at my weight because they consider anything above a BMI of 27 to be “risky”. I am the first to agree that I am fat, even very fat (I wear a size 18 US). After a car accident in 2001, the back pain made it difficult to be active and coupled with PCOS I gained a lot of weight.
I lost 35 pounds two years ago and have managed to keep it off. I am physically active and eat healthy and even stopped smoking six months ago. I find it difficult to do more than walking as exercise, though, because of the size of my breasts. Wearing a bra, even a properly fitted one, amplifies the pressure on the middle of my spine and affects my breathing.
They will not consider that I am also a very muscular woman, who can drop a dress size but actually gain weight. Also, they will not deduct the breast weight from their expectations either.
Yesterday the doctor dismissed me and my questions, but then had no problem prescribing me pain killers.
Anyhoo, I have been feeling so frustrated at being ignored but you and your slideshow make me feel like I’ve been heard and that has helped me tremendously. I am going to continue my path to better health, and will find a way to finance my breast reduction surgery on my own.
thanks Kate!
Gertie, as someone who has actually been through a breast reduction, I can tell you two things:
1) It is not a panacea. I went from a 38HH to a 38DD and I still ache (it’s definitely better, but I was off-balance for a few years and I still have upper back pain). I completely think it was the right thing to do, but I know I had higher expectations than were appropriate. I also lost sensation. That, my friends, was the biggest damn bummer EVAH. Very individual and personal decision, but just so you know: you might not get the relief you’re looking for. Can you see a physio or an osteopath over there?
2) I actually gained weight after the surgery. See, until I got the girls lopped off, I didn’t realize I had a ginormous belly. When I saw it I was mortified and depressed. Hello, comfort eating and staying in bed when I wasn’t at work. :( I have gotten over all that now but the belly is still there, looming larger than ever as though a tribute to the Missing Girls.
I’m sorry that you evidently have a useless physician (I read your encounter on your website…whoo, that’s rough). I imagine that (s)he is just following the NHS protocols, but still…stoopid. My heart is with you.
Oh, and congratulations on quitting the smokes! While everyone else bickers about how important losing OMG all that fat is to your health, the smart doctors are saying it’s better to gain weight because of smoking cessation than it is to keep smoking so you don’t blow up into a big fatty cow. Wev.
Thanks for that. It does help to have input from someone who’s been there. Based on my size, I will probably require removal and repositioning, resulting in sensation loss– I almost expect it– and at this point I am willing to risk that.
I don’t know if I have unrealistic expectations with regards to my pain, or not. I’ve been wanting reduction surgery since I was 20 but held off in case I had children and wanted to nurse. I never did have kids, so at 36 I decided to get in the best shape as I could by the time I was 39 so that I could have the reduction and then start 40 off with a whole improved body. I’ve had breasts since I was 8, and they didn’t really change much with the weight, thank gawd. I plan to reduce down to a C cup, and hope that this will allow me to exercise in a way that will increase my back strength and give me the physical freedom to literally climb mountains.
Doc prescribed painkillers, and also referred me to the obseity clinic. I’m holding onto hope that those people will be better suited to handling this and can get me sorted. Fingers crossed.
Just chiming in on the gym class experiences…My sophmore year of h.s., the very thin, driller of an gym teacher was telling my all-girls class about how important is is to work out. Not a bad lesson, until she started pointing out all of the bad things that could happen to your body, including, in her words, “the disgusting pockets of fat underneath your arms that seem to extend from your chest” while looking at me in my tank top (I often didn’t change into the stupid gym uniform…). Thirteen years later and still remember. And I HATE her. I was 15, DD breasts, and 170 pounds. Bitch.
Why is it I don’t see typos until they are already posted?
From age 8, until my first year of college, I myself held many prejudices against fat, . My first roommate, Tina, was a large woman (probably a size 22US) who would kick my ass every single day on the racquetball court. Ten minutes into the game and my (at the time) skinny self would be sweating and trying to catch a breath while she just kept pounding the court.
Wow, size does not reflect fitness! Being fat does not equate being lazy!
I am a big (heh) believer in being healthy and active, but I no longer subscribe to the belief that you need to be a stick insect to achieve that. I finally see the true beauty in just being a woman and I think each one of us needs to make an effort to show our appreciation and keep people (like Kristin’s gym teacher) from perpetuating the hate.
This is great! I used to be a BIG triathlete (BMI around 30). I could run a 1/2 marathon in a little under 2 hours and loved it and i could bench press 10 reps at about 120 lbs and carry 2 40 lb bags of dog food at a time. Then i had a huge car wreck (broke my neck but wasn’t paralyzed TG) and over about a year lost about 40 lbs. I figure at least 15 of those were muscle. I am now in the “normal” category with a BMI of 24. I can barely run 3 miles without being sore for 3 more days, i can barely lift my 25 lb daughter (and my hand gets tired holding a cup of coffee for more than a few minutes). I’ve never been so weak and unhealthy feeling in all my life. Yet everyday people say “you look GREAT…you must have fully recovered…you look like you’ve been working out (huh? working out was what i was doing when i was “obese”)…” etc etc…inane comments that equate thin with fit/healthy. My office manager weighs the same as i do but has about 1/2 the body fat (we’ve both had ours calculated). SHE looks fit and healthy but VERY built while i just look kind of average.
I would like to see a slide show with a bunch of people who weigh the same but look very different.
And medical literature is finally catching up (although the doctors are not) to the fact that it’s HEALTHIER to be active and fat than inactive and thin.
I truly believe i wouldn’t have done as well in my accident if i hadn’t had some extra weight on me. My nutritional status was horrid for a long time (which is why i lost weight) and i probably would be very ill right now if i’d started out in the “normal” category.
Great stuff! Thanks for posting it (and glad i came across it, rather randomly).
Oh, and speaking of smoking, I read somewhere that smoking a pack a day adds the equivalent of 150 lbs of extra weight in terms of health “risk”. The average person gains 30 lbs when they quit smoking so most people are still coming out ahead in the health game. (in the body image game, well, that’s a different story, obviously).
So, you’re saying somebody who’s 300 pounds or so has the same health risks as a smoker? Last I read, smokers have a 6000% greater chance of premature death (i.e. getting lung or mouth cancers) than non-smokers, whereas 300 pound people have health “risks” exactly equal to people currently in the “normal” categories (best health is in the “overweight” group.) So, where’s your data to justify comparing people with “150 pounds of extra weight” to smokers?
I guess you think you’re supporting fat acceptance, but you’re still bashing fat people. (Or, at least, people fatter than you are.)
Wow–great site. I love the illustrated BMI. Right now I’m in grad school with a ton of Type A neurotics who would just as soon gain 5 pounds as get anything less than an A+ in a class. As they reach their late 20s they freak out because they’re not as lithe as they once were, and most of them have developed sports/exercise injuries. There’s just no moderation here…COOK whole, healthy food, eat in moderation, don’t binge when stressed, and do exercise that doesn’t harm your body. I think everyone leaves their brains at work. It’s nice to see some refreshing, non-guilt-ridden perspective here. Thanks.
[...] watch this absolutely amazing slideshow showing photos of people with their BMI labels. I think my favorite is the three sisters whose BMI [...]
Well, it seems there is no category called “healthy.” Yikes. And here is sit, morbidly obese, but on my way to the gym. This is so sick, and I am so embarassed to see that our society still buys into this outrageous thinking.
A million blessings on you for this project. It’s uplifted me in ways it is impossible to convey. Most of the time I just can’t “tell” what I look like. My BMI, at 30.2, says I’m obese, but I feel kinda okay — healthier than most “normal” people I know and not all that bad looking. At the same time, I gained a lot of weight over the past few years (a pretty healthy diet, but enormous stress and not enough sleep) and many days, barely recognize myself, and mourn the loss of the body I used to have — and the different way people treat me and look at me now, and the assumptions they make about me, etc. As a result, I avoided sexual intimacy like the plague the past few years (burying something that had been so important and fun to me), assuming no man would find me attractive anyway. But recently (of course, while I was doing what I love at a time when I was truly happy and oblivious and least expected it), I met a really sweet man that I really hit it off with. He kept pursuing me and I kept assuming I was misunderstanding his intentions. I was really dense about it. Even once he made his attraction clear, I still had my doubts. I just couldn’t believe that he could really be interested in me “that way”, because no matter how much we have in common non-physically or how well we hit it off, I just couldn’t get past that fact he must find me unattractive because I’m obese and he is an extraordinarily fit cyclist with a gorgeous body and years younger than me. But after viewing these wonderful photos, now I see myself in a new light — apparently the one he’s been seeing me in all along. It’s too late tonight, but I can’t wait to tell him tomorrow — no, show him — that I’ve put the doubts that held me back with him to rest. So give yourself a big round of applause, cuz thanks to you this fat chicks gettin’ her mojo back.
Awesome awesome awesome.
Thank you Kate for doing this, as always you are an inspiration!
Oooh what a cool project. Can anybody submit their picture and join?
Thank you for doing this. BMI is a very messed up concept and your slide show was a beautiful way to dismantle all too powerful stereotypes. I am someone who has battled anorexia for years, yet have rarely been “underweight” – the BMI had done my head in a number of times. Especially when folks tell me I can’t have an eating disorder because I’m not under 18.5 on the BMI chart.
Your work is beautiful, as is each person (and cat) that submitted a picture. Thank you.
I love that I found this! Speaking of fantastic health advice from your doctor, you kids will love this. I am obese at 5′4 188 size 14 (I am strong as hell, thank you muscles!) and travel a lot for my job. My doctor pretty much always reminds me how OBESE I am and how i really need to get my BMI to healthy (hum…my BP is 117/62 all other health tests say i AM healthy) place. She suggested when I am out with clients for dinner I try a few of tricks that her friend (BTW, a friend the the Doc. said had an eating disorder!!!) does. “Just push food around on your plate. Don’t actually EAT it. Just make it look like you ate it. And order vodka sodas.” Wow, thanks Doc!
Thank you for doing this. More people really need to know how stupid and wrong the whole BMI-business is.
That is just so awesome! Loved it, and thanks!
I absolutely love your slideshow , what a fantastic idea :)
[...] in the “normal” range, is often a crock of shit. See how stupid BMI is, illustrated here. I’m much less concerned with the number than I am with my size. I range from a size 9-12, [...]
I just mentioned in front of my whole class (40 people) that the BMI is inaccurate. We are supposed to do the skin caliper BMI next week in class and I am unwilling based on research and the reality that the BMI is very inaccurate with just 5 measly little numbers between “normal” and “obese”. I am so fucking sick of this supposed Health Promotion class that every single student is required to take.
The teacher even mentioned that the insurance companies are the ones that use the BMI to determine what type of coverage people deserve! I am so sick of big business telling me if I am healthy or not!
I think I will send him to this website for an explanation as to why I refuse to do the skin caliper test. If you know of some good source I can which refer to the inaccuracies of BMI, I would greatly appreciate it.
Beth,
A good place to start is over at Sandy Szwarc’s Junkfood Science (www.junkfoodscience.blogspot.com). She has ongoing items of interest (and then some), and also has links in the right hand column to a series she did a couple of years ago for Tech Central Station. There are also plenty of books around (Google: “obesity” & Paul Campos, Glenn Gaesser, Laura Fraser, Gina Kolata, Dean Edell… ) Happy reading!
Beth, if you can get your hands on the full text of this 2006 study published in the Lancet, you’re good to go. Researchers at the Mayo Clinic in MN looked at 40 studies covering 250,000 people and found:
-the underweight group had an increased risk for both total mortality and cardiovascular mortality
-the overweight group had the least risk of both
-moderately obese people (BMI 30-35) had no increased risk in either category
-those with a BMI greater than 35 had no increase in total mortality but the highest risk for cardiovascular mortality — which was only slightly higher than the risk for the underweight category
Interestingly, the abstract says nothing about the “normal” category.
I feel a little confused. I watched the slideshow, and I felt the categories the individuals fell into according to what was indicated were accurate. I guess it doesn’t feel good to be labelled “overweight”, “obese”, etc., but the people pictured in those categories had noticeable extra weight. And the those labelled “normal” or “underweight” appeared to lack extra weight accordingly. Not trying to be mean, it’s just an observation.
Anon, we’ve been through this about 80 times already. Your “observation” is profoundly unoriginal. And it would seem most of the people viewing the project disagree with you. *shrug*
Blah blah fat-people-look-fat-cakes. Not everyone’s gonna get it; what can ya do.
Incidentally, does anyone ever say they’re not trying to be an asshole when they’re not trying to be an asshole?
Oh look! Anon knows exactly what the ideal weight for human beings is; see, if you’re above it, you have “extra” weight; if you’re below it, you “lack extra” weight. ANON HAS DEMONSTRATED THAT S/HE KNOWS THE MEANING OF THE WORD “EXTRA” IN RELATION TO AN ARBITRARILY DEFINED “NORM”
Yeah, anon, haven’t you learned anything from this site? Geez, fat people are angry and defensive about being fat, duh! Do you have to throw it in their faces?
Oh, boy! We have a tie for Missing the Point Award of the Day!
Who knew it was such a hotly contested title?
It’s particularly awesome when non-readers seek out the blog in order to be snide and sarcastic… about how angry we are.
Wait, forgive me, it’s not a tie. Sara and Anon have the exact same IP address! SHOCKER.
Sifl vs. Olly cage match!
On the personal experiences with gym class thing (and I’m in the slide show – gray sweater and jeans)…
I was another kid who weighed around 200 in high school. I had mixed feelings about gym class. I liked playing sports, but hated distance running. I had good lower body and core strength and better than average flexibility, but very little upper body strength. 40 situps? No problem. Pull-ups? Forget it. I used to walk or bike the 3 miles to school, and I was in the marching band, so I wasn’t in horrible shape. I could sprint up to 600 yards, but no way was I going to run the mile. I walked it in 14 minutes.
Back in the day (early 80’s) they didn’t test BMI or single out the fat kids like they do now. I mean, I wasn’t exactly the gym teacher’s pet and I was one of the last picked for teams, but I think it’s worse for fat kids now. I didn’t love gym class, but it didn’t ruin physical activity for me, either.
[...] Hallelujah! Let us eat cake! And even if you don’t feel like cake, be sure to check out Kate’s BMI project. [...]
“THANK YOU for showing the full range of real, beautiful women (and cats). Women are human beings, not numbers on a scale.”
Whoever posted that was right on the money. I’m so sick of women being told they have to be like toothpicks to be healthy. It’s disrespectful on so many levels.
[...] BMI Project: Shapely Prose (or on Flickr, here. Plus, a great article here). [...]
When talking to my doctor once, I mentioned that i knew i needed to be lifting weights or something like that more: lose a little fat and gain a little muscle. I like this doctor quite a bit, but he pulled out the BMI chart and said that i was on the low end of normal, almost underweight and so i should not worry. He basically said that women are too concerned about their weight. That may be true, but it is not true for me and not what I had said. The BMI chart he used was based solely on weight and height (which is not indicative of body composition). As we know, muscle weighs more than fat. If I gained muscle and lost fat my charted BMI may remain the same, but my body composition would have been altered and my energy level would be better which was what i was wanting to achieve. I am more concerned with what I can do and how I feel.
I couldn’t get the link to the Lancet article to work (for some reason this page is still loading for me and so the link wouldn’t function), but it would be interesting to see if they looked at body composition at all or solely the BMI chart. It is actually possible to have an ‘unhealthy’ level of body fat and fall in the ‘normal’ range on BMI, just as it is possible to have a ‘healthy’ level of body fat and fall in the overweight range. It is very silly that we are all aware of this and yet BMI is still being used. It is really time we demand physicians use metrics that actually relate to health so that they can advise us realistically.
After looking at all the pictures it seems that BMI is quite accurate after all. Sure, there are some exceptions and there is some inaccuracy at the thresholds, but overall it is pretty damn accurate. Really, all the people where I was thinking they do not look overweight or obese were right at the limit for their respective categories. And obviously, somebody with a BMI of 25 is not going to suddenly look different from somebody with a BMI of 24.9.
Lord on high it’s a brand new troll.
Yes it is, Joie, and he’s about to be banned, since this isn’t the only thread where he’s dropped in to enlighten us without reading a word of the site.
And obviously, somebody with a BMI of 25 is not going to suddenly look different from somebody with a BMI of 24.9.
Gee, ya think? And ya think maybe that’s THE POINT OF THE PROJECT? Since everything from the way people are treated by doctors to whether they can get health insurance at all is determined by those arbitrary thresholds?
So you have people who weight 140-150 pounds, and within that category you have a whole bunch of people who all look very different from one another. Short, tall, skinny, fat…
What this made me think of, oddly enough, is that right now I am the same weight I was when I got married. And you can fit two of me-now in my wedding dress. I, er…took up a number of activities (rollerblading, yoga, bellydance, rugby, biking, hiking, and pilates) in the six-plus years since my wedding.
Same BMI (33.7), same person, two completely different sizes and fitness levels. That says better than anything to me that BMI is pretty useless as a measure of anything real and substantive.
I wonder if I can get my rugby team to take pics in uniform for the flickr stream?
Nifty slideshow.
As a very very fat woman myself (my dress size is 6x. I don’t know what I weigh as I am off the scale when my doctor insists on weighing me), I had a bit of a revelation watching the show. All the underweight people, lovely as they doubtless are, kinda made me flinch a little bit. I am clearly a horrible bigoted person. Sorry thin people! I can’t help my instincts, but I do seriously respect your bodies, even if they make me want to make you a cup of tea and a plate of dinner. I’m going to work on this prejudice of mine that I didn’t even know I had, before I end up checking Satan’s spreadsheets in hell for all eternity.
Secondly, I have to admit, my reaction to all the so-called overweight /obese/morbidly obese people was the same: “Come *on*!” e.g she/he/they is/aren’t overweight! They’re perfectly freaking normal.
In conclusion: I take your point.
I should apologize. I am trying to “enlighten” the anti-fat individuals of the internet by posting a link to the BMI project. It’s safe to say any new trolls you are getting are coming from extremely hostile spaces to begin with. I post at a lot of message boards where insecure men worship supermodels who are probably suffering from eating disorders. Needless to say, anybody above a size four is “fat” to them.
Not only is this a great slideshow (blows Inconvenient Truth out o’ the water), I was surprised at the guys’ pics. I’m 5′4 165lbs and my boyfriend is 6′2 and 138, so I know he’s thin…but the men who are supposedly overweight? Some of them had visible stomach muscles! It is also shocking to see other women who share my numbers and realize that my self-perception is so off base. It has taken me twenty years to realize that I don’t need to lose weight.
Also, I think gym teachers are programmed to target fat kids. I think mine gave up on me in eighth grade. It wasn’t until I started backpacking and doing yoga that I realized “exercise” can be fun–and I am good at it! Shock and awe! Now if only the insurance companies would realize that we can be “overweight/obese/morbidly obese” and still be healthier than many thin people…
Some irony, for whatever it’s worth:
I’ve been having some trouble with my health lately. For a still-mysterious reason, my weight is dropping like a hot rock. This morning, my weight was 103, which puts my BMI at 18.2 – officially “underweight.”
The irony? My bust, waist, and hip measurements are exactly the same today as they were when that BMI Project photo was taken (you can look it up, but I’m 115 in the photo). My BMI could be “normal” or “underweight” in that photo, and no one would ever know the damn difference. Because visually, you can’t.
Go figure.
That is so true, Dani. People have this deep need to believe they can diagnose whether someone is “too thin” or “too fat” from a picture or their clothes size or appearance, and you CAN’T. You cannot understand or control others in that way. People just need to recognize this and deal with it.
I hope your health improves and you find out what is causing the changes to your weight and the problems you are experiencing.
Incidentally, we occasionally get hits from people who are googling things like “what size would I wear at 5′4″ 175 pounds” or similar queries. Sorry, folks, we just can’t answer that, and neither can anybody else.
Well, the obvious answer is “the one that fits” – but nobody wants to hear that.
Man, if that’s not wisdom for the ages. Nicely put.
[...] huh. So, these doctors will be using a test that isn’t exactly accurate in even determining how fat a person is to help halt the “obesity problem”? Are y’all as lost as I [...]
Are you still accepting photos?
Attention everyone: From now on, every single “I don’t get it, fat people look fat” comment on this thread will be deleted. Usually I gauge based on whether it will be fun to bat you around, but hear this: from now on, you’re ALL fucking boring.
Aww, you deleted that one just as I WAS batting her around!
I support this policy, though.
I know, it was a good batting too, but overall OMG SO TOTALLY YAWN re: disingenuous concern trolls.
I asked for an explanation.
Rather than saying “LYKE OMG YOUR POINT IS SO BORING!” How about you try to explain yourselves.
No, you didn’t ask for an explanation, Andrea. You made a REALLY BORING POINT, which has already been addressed numerous times in this thread.
And if you actually want an explanation, you can read the fucking blog.
And if you actually want an explanation, you can read the fucking blog.
Noooooo don’t make me thiiiiiiiiiink
I love people who don’t read more than 3 comments before them, let alone some of the actual blog they’re commenting on, yet feel entitled to demand that we drop everything and explain basic things to them.
See those 400 other blog posts? THAT’S WHERE WE EXPLAIN THINGS.
You so totally rock! Pictures are worth a million words…
My medical clinic recently announced that as of Jan. 1, they will start documenting BMI for all their patients. I can’t imagine what they think this will accomplish. Oh wait. It’s for our own good.
Unfrickingbelievable. I feel like I should fight it somehow. Any tactical suggestions welcome.
Perrin J – I think you should fight it. I mean, has anyone ever tried? What if the nurse asks to weigh you, and you just say “no, thank you.” Passive resistance, my friend.
I don’t mind knowing my weight *for myself,* because it’s just a friggin’ number, but I’ll be damned if I’m going to allow them to weigh my moral value, even if if my personal doctor does think it’s for my own good. Hell if I’m going to passively contribute to his delusion by allowing him to keep weighing me. So there.
(Big talk: I’ve never actually done this, but I TOTALLY WILL the next time I can afford to visit a doctor).
I always refuse the scale. ;) I’m very polite about it; I simply say, “No thank you,” like I would say, “No thank you, I don’t care for dessert.” So far they’ve never made an issue out of it. They might come down on me like a ton of bricks, though, now that they’ve decided it’s some kind of critical vital sign. :(
Really, unless you’re going to be receiving anesthesia or some other medication that is dosed according to body mass, there is no absolute medical need for them to know exactly what we weigh. Why can’t the doctor just make an eyeball estimate?
I’m impressed and inspired! I think you may have just convinced me to stick to my resolve next time I’m asked to step on the scale. Thanks!
Wonderful….Simply Wonderful. Have been “lurking” here for awhile and love all the wonderful and inspiring posts and peeps here….
Hey Kate! The BMI project is great!
But other than the whole BMI thing being a complete hoax (and people still believe in it), I’ve heard that people were gonna adjust the “normal” range further down the scale for Asians just because we’re supposedly smaller. http://www.mydr.com.au/default.asp?Article=3735
Way to go on making us feel worse about our bodies.
OMG, Su, that’s insane.
Soooooo, is there a population anywhere in the world that is good to go according to the Powers That Be? Or are they saying that all of us are unhealthy and need to change?
Any big famines going on right now? Maybe those people would be healthy . . .
I’ve heard that people were gonna adjust the “normal” range further down the scale for Asians just because we’re supposedly smaller.
Yeah, and all exactly the same!
Jesus.
I’ve come to the conclusion that “professionals” who rely on BMI have never met any actual people, especially actual people who have boobs, muscles or come from what might be called “sturdy peasant stock”.
Paging sweet machine… this is both ludicrously off-topic and way late, but would you be willing to share some of the places where you like to shop for clothes? I absolutely LOVE your outfit in the BMI project. If you don’t wanna divulge that’s no problem, I just thought I would ask.
What is interesting is when you are technically overweight but still wear a size 6. What’s up with clothes sizing?
Leslief, I think the better question is, what’s up with the BMI? (At least one person in the project is “overweight” and a size 4.)
Are you sure Moxie is only 1 foot tall? Is that standing all the way up, or just measuring her legs? Because even a 12-week-old kitten is a good foot long if you stretch it out and that looks like a fully grown cat to me. I’d give her at least 2 feet, maybe 2-1/2, and that would probably ratchet her down to “barely overweight” at 12 pounds.
But DGMS about vets and their attitudes about cat weight. Two of my cats are 20-pound bruisers, and yet one is much more “girthful” than the other one. And the second one, who’s actually a bit heavier, is constantly in motion, wanting to play fetch all day long. But to the vet, weight is weight. Bleh.
Meowser, I think the measurement for Moxie was height at the shoulder, not length. And in fact, she’s under 12 inches by that measurement, but the BMI calculator would only take heights in feet.
I have just lost track of time because I was reading your blog – the time in Denmark is now 2:52 am and I was supposed to have gone to bed three hours ago!!! I am so glad that I found it!!!
I ended up on this website tonight because a “friend” (I’m using quotation marks because she is a dear friend but is kind of preachy when it comes to weight and won’t let my “overweight” be) told my that I most assuredly have BED – why else would I be overweight, and what else would be the cause of my depression? I didn’t have the courage to tell her of then, but now I will. As I said she is preachy about loosing weight because she’s lost a lot of wait, but ho – she’s put it on again!
I have never really been bullied about my weight directly but of course by society in general (yes, Danish society is also prejudiced against people on the high end of the weight scale – pun not originally intended but left in when noticed ;o) ). In Denmark we don’t have to take the test you have been talking about but everybody have to have check ups by the school nurse – here I was singled out and had to go see her once a month instead of once a year to “keep my weight in check”. And even though I got a small flag the days I had lost weight (the Danish national flag named Dannebrog is used as symbol of celebration e.g. for birthdays, wedding, etc. – so in this case it meant the same as a gold star), the humiliation of having to go to the nurse in the middle of classes all the way through the school far outweighed the positive feeling the flags was suppose to give me. And then imagine the days when I didn’t get a flag…
Luckily my present doctor asked me in my first consultation with her if my weight was something she should address. I said no I was fine with it and she has only mentioned it one time since then (when I had an ultrasound made to confirmed gallstones she simply said “your liver shows up a bit diffused but that’s normal with your weight” – and that was the end of that comment).
So in general I am perfectly fine with my weight but I do have a few family members and friends who are preachy – ironically most are heavy too and preach because they themselves are trying to loose weight and think they are doing really well that way. I have not been ably too stand up to them before but, as a mentioned earlier in my little novel, now I have a basis to do so!
Line Thy, I am always sad but not surprised to see that the situation for fat people is often the same or worse outside of the US. That weight monitoring program you had to do in school must have been really embarrassing. On the positive side your current doctor sounds great!
See now – I notice some things about ALL those people, that they have in common: 1) each one is, without exception, DARLING; 2) each one looks interesting and friendly; 3) each one without exception looks like someone I’d enjoy having a cuppa and a chinwag with; 4) one of them has a tummy I’d like to smooch. MOXIE!! It’s MOXIE (what on earth were you thinking?) {{laughing}}
Last summer I drove a support vehicle for people on a 500-mile bike tour. The *majority* of the riders, ALL of whom covered the whole 500 miles, were over 40, and would also be described as “obese” or “morbidly obese” in your slide show. There are MANY people who, being stout to greater or lesser degrees, are nonetheless as hearty and healthy and buff as one of those alleged paragons in TV exercise videos. Saw it with my own eyes. So there. Shut up. {{grin}}
scg, thanks! Let me try to remember for that outfit… At the time that picture was taken I was wearing 12/14, so some of my clothes were from plus stores and some were from straight stores. For that particular outfit, I got the little cardigan at Urban Outfitters (their L fit over my E-cup boobs! Worth a shot for inbetweenies or not-so-endowed fatties). I’m pretty sure I got the t-shirt at a now defunct store called Tiger Tiger in Seattle, but I can’t remember the brand — it might have been local. And the skirt I got at a thrift store in Vancouver. I did very well thrifting when I lived in the PNW! But in general when I’m an inbetweenie, (besides thrift stores) I shop at H&M, Old Navy, B & Lu, and Torrid (mostly on half-off clearance). Now I’ve lost some weight because of illness, and I’m baffled as to where to shop!
Oh, and the knee socks were from Torrid and the jewelry is handmade by friends in Oregon. :-)
Yay! Thanks so much for the info. I am about to quit my traditional office job (engineer at a consulting firm) and embark on an as-yet-unknown different career path, and in between jobs at least (and maybe beyond if I end up working alone or in a little more creative environment), I want to start expressing my own fashion sense a little more. You folks in the slide show offer some great inspiration. :)
It is at least good to know that Urban Outfitters might be suitable for the more well-endowed (American Apparel [which is next door to the local UO], I’m looking at you with loathing on this score). All of the Hip Young People at UO make me break out in hives and I end up racing through and never trying anything on.
I will venture into H&M again too. Though I feel I should boycott them on principle since they got rid of the awesome Jytte Meilvang line they used to have. The overdyed purple dark-wash cuffed capri jeans from that line that I used to have were pretty much the coolest plus-sized garment I ever had, especially 6-8 years ago when you didn’t have a lot of options in the first place. I love LB in many ways but it couldn’t hold a candle to H&M’s departed plus line.
Thanks again!! Your friends are very talented jewelers too. The necklace is gorgeous.
ha…at 5′3 and 147 I’m apparently “overweight”, according to the BMI.
Ludicrous.
I like the slideshow. Puts things in perspective.
[...] the measurement we all know and love. Love to call bullshit on, I mean. So such massive fatties as the “obese” people in the BMI Project slideshow, for example, would be denied surgery because it’s “too hard” and has [...]
Right on. This BMI photo is ‘food for thought’ and yes, with some folks BMI just doesn’t compute. I mean – it made me think of my own situation and my weight. Some say under weight – and I say – spot on. Thanks – you’ve lifted the largest eating day of the year.
[...] find Kate Harding’s BMI Project both fascinating and full of hot pictures of cute big girls. The best kind of social commentary. [...]
LOL. I liked the way you proved whatever point you were trying to prove by this slide. I loved it, to say the least.
I’ve been through some weight loss programs and doctors can’t really explain why I seem to register heavily on the scales yet I have visibly lost a lot of inches. I quit the programs and just made a variety of not weight-loss but health maintenance exercises and diets to suit my mood and lifestyle. Admittedly though, I am currently violating them in favor of “holiday bliss”. LOL. Anyway, thank you for this post. Your blog is really informative.
Kudos!
Well, the situation over here in Asia (especially in Taiwan, Korea and Japan) is pretty bad. It doesn’t help that streets are choke-full of size 0 girls. So even if you’re a normal size 8 or 10, you’re still considered fat.
And I weep for myself and my friends. I’ve got friends who weigh in at 120 pounds but are still hell-bent on losing weight. It’s so hard to win when men over here are narrow-minded bigots who choose to ignore anything above a size 10. They already have an idea of what ALL girls should look like: skinny and with long hair. No wonder we’re all looking the same these days.
I just wish the Fat-Acceptance movement would gather more support here. People have simply decided that being fat is bad and that’s the end. Everyone loses hope after a while of being on the heavy side.
One thing that I think a lot of people don’t know (or don’t want to admit) is that the BMI was never intended by its creator to be a diagnostic tool of any kind. Most doctors don’t know this, or won’t admit it if they do. Look up “Adolphe Quetelet” sometime; he was an early social scientist who wanted to categorize people based on their body-mass index, not diagnose or treat them. The Wikipedia page on the BMI says as much under the “Accuracy” subhead: The BMI is meant to broadly categorize populations for purely statistical purposes.
Using the BMI to measure health is like using a scale to measure distance. The tool is not designed for the purpose it’s being used for.
Yeah, Adam, most people around here know the whole history of the BMI. The fact that too many doctors don’t is part of the point of this project.
Hi Kate,
Sorry, as a social scientist (and brand-new to this blog) I make a point of telling people about Quetelet every chance I get. I apologize; I didn’t see mention of him on the site, so I thought I’d put out what the original purpose of the BMI was supposed to be. My bad.
Adam, we can hardly complain about people going into detail about exactly why BMI is and always has been a crock. I get all spittly about Belgian statisticians every so often, but it’s good to have the backing of a social scientist.
And I really liked “using the BMI to measure health is like using a scale to measure distance.”
All the media circus about “60% of adults overweight or obese!” should really be reading “statistical measure no longer describes population!”
Sorry for the attitude, Adam. You had the misfortune of sounding vaguely like people who come in here and say things like, “BMI was never meant to be an indicator of health, but FAT IS STILL UNHEALTHY, LET ME EDUCATE YOU SOME MORE.”
So, I was snarkier than I needed to be. My bad, actually.
It’s okay, Kate. I didn’t mention that I’m a Big and Not Tall gay man (370 lbs, and 5′10″), so I totally get the whole “hard to find clothing” thing. And the self-image thing. And the interaction-with-people thing. (Context is such a necessary thing!) If anything, I was being mildly snarky myself, at the people who still believe BMI is a valid diagnostic tool. I’ve had arguments with doctors about this every time I go to get my medications renewed.
I discovered your blog the other day through a link elsewhere, and I’ve been reading avidly and nodding my head off. Thank you for being here and saying what you say. It’s much appreciated.
Thanks, Adam. And welcome!
Thank you for this.
[...] that garners thousands of visitors and hundreds of comments a day, especially since the fabulous Illustrated BMI Project got so much attention. She’s glad to not be a big-time blogger, she [...]
this is still flawed…
For example, Jessica the “overweight triathlete” on your flickr page. I use her as since she and I are the same height, and look about the same size but she has about 25 lbs of (presumably) muscle on me, while I still classify around normal.
On the BMI wiki it says it’s a “means of classifying sedentary (physically inactive) individuals with an average body composition”, so Jessica probably doesn’t even qualify for this classification scale
Also, isn’t there a more accurate measurement system where the doctor actually uses calipers and all kinds of equipment to obtain a more precise BMI? I know I saw something like this on a science show years ago, but I’m not sure if it was BMI or some other standard of measurement.
Courtney, I’m not really sure what point you’re trying to make, but no, there is no way to “obtain a more precise BMI.” BMI is your weight divided by the square of your height — that’s it, that’s all you get. What you see in the project is THE measure being used to determine things like who’s insurable, who can adopt, who can immigrate to New Zealand, who’s part of the “obesity epidemic” scare stats. Yes, there are (expensive) tests to determine your body composition, but that’s not what people use, now is it?
Calipers and whatnot can measure your body fat, to give you an idea of your fat/muscle ratio, which BMI cannot. Two different measurements.
The BMI wiki doesn’t mean shit. I’m sure someone added the “sedentary” line to account for the muscle factor, but doctors, insurance companies, and everyone else FJ just mentioned don’t take muscle into consideration. Just height and weight, period. Which is ONE reason (there are many besides the “muscle is denser than fat” argument) why BMI is a load of crap.
[...] P.S. Check out this BMI project. [...]
I’m 6′7″ and it’s a real joy here in the UK to watch the doctor take out his/her ruler – extend the line on the chart (which generally stops at 6′5″) and explain to me that I’m morbidly Obese – I mean, they don’t even have a proper chart, who are they to tell me that!
Love the blog by the way!
Jim
This is totally awesome. It makes me feel better about the way I look.
The site inspired me to figure out my BMI, 25.7, which is overweight. I’m a tall 6′1″ male, who weighs 195. I have been doing ashtanga yoga for a year & am in fantastic shape. My body fat is very low. No person alive would call me fat or say that I could or should loose any weight.
Not so, Alejandro. Every time a news article talks about the 60% of the country that’s “overweight or obese,” they’re talking about you, my friend.
[...] and my choice of baked goods have bestowed on me. OK, my BMI is a little high (but apparently BMI is a load of tosh), but my fat is in the right places (i.e. not around my waist, smothering my internal organs) and [...]
Wow, this is fantastic. I found you from a link on another site this morning, and I’ve spent the last hour+ reading the comments.
Isn’t it sad that this is the first thing I’ve ever read about BMI being a crock? I’ve always felt conflicted about it, b/c according to the BMI I waver — EVERY DAMN DAY — between “normal” and “overweight” at 5′2″ and mid-130s, but when I exercise more I get heavier with muscle and end up solidly in the “overweight” category even though I feel better! But I just assumed those charts had some concrete medical truth behind them. Aargghh! It makes me so mad that BMI charts are taken as gospel, and what makes me even madder is that I fell for it!
From now on, I’m tossing BMI right out the window, and I’m sending more people to this site. It’s an eye-opener, so thank you.
I wonder what they have to say about my big fat ass. WIC told me Aiden is just under obese & when I went to the doctor with him they (both female) were like…um, no! He’s actually a normal weight & a rediculous height, making him super skinny. What medical school did that broad graduate from? Probably didn’t.
[...] than numbers on a scale. We are not our BMI. I still hate that chart. I love Kate Harding’s BMI Project and how it illustrates the stupidity of that measure. A woman who wears a size six is no better or [...]
Another project you could put together, to make the message even more powerful — show the range of variation between people of the same height with the same BMI. It would be harder to put together, but it would hammer the point home stronger.
JL- Or, YOU could put that project together.
The war against irrational body standards is best won by setting up battles on many fronts!
I’ve only recently found this blog and sooooo love it.
Wanted to chime in on gym experiences. I know why I don’t like sports or exercise and the mere sound of a ball bouncing in the neighborhood can send me into a panic attack. Thank my high school gym coach, Coach Partch.
He loved the guys, hated us young women. He allowed (even encouraged) the boys to throw balls at us when we were walking to and from class. I was knocked out cold by a basketball on the way to the locker room and was told “boys will be boys.” He yelled and screamed and failed me from one quarter when I was unable to run the mile because I was one day back from recovering from a dreadful flu and barely able to stand. I could not walk hardly, let alone attempt to run.
Yes, I am overweight. I’ve been overweight all my life, some more than others. Anyone else tired of hearing “if only”? I’ve been told I’d be so pretty if only I’d (lose weight, stand up straighter, not breathe through my mouth, ….lose weight–yes, that’s the one I hear the most!).
My BMI says I’m obese, heading towards Morbidly Obese. Most people wouldn’t believe that, although many agree I’m “overweight” but “not that much”-thanks god for a decent height and a frame that hides some of it. :) I’m still struggling with accepting myself, obviously, but I am starting to try.
I’m better about self-confidence and self-esteem thanks to my husband, who loves me as I am and never comments about my weight (although he has pointed out that I seem happier and feel better when I regularly walk or swim–and he’s right, so why don’t I do it more often and stick with it?). I’m working on that too.
My new year’s resolution list, for the first time in my life, will not have “lose weight” on it! That feels great to say. I am going to have “increase walking, swimming or other activities that make me feel good” and “eat more fruit” because these things tend to make me happy–not because they will get me to some other goal.
Sorry for the long post, but this blog has been inspiring since I found it about two weeks ago, but I’ve never written to say so. Thanks! K
You have got to be kidding. This is all simply anecdotal evidence and has no basis in determinations of mortality.
The BMI is generally recognized as a guideline to healthy weight. If you don’t recognize the medical establishment, then what are your criteria for belief?
-jim
I love the slideshow…it is a perfect display of beauty and health…it also made me laugh because BMI is ridiculous
Hey Shapelings, I approved Jim’s comment for you guys, as a Festivus present. Go to town! I’m giggling uncontrollably, myself.
Laughing too hard to answer Jim’s question right now.
*stares blankly at Jim’s comment* *snicker..snort…giggle*
He’s serious about that question, ain’t he?
*wipes eyes*…ok.
All I have to say to that one is…the BMI has determinations of mortality? Cause, see, according to the BMI, I’m morbidly obese. Which means, I should be like…about to die. RIGHT NOW. But I’m feeling rather groovy, ya know?
So, it seems that, based on your own comment, dear, that Kate’s right in saying BMI is bullshit. But that’s just my analysis.
Happy Festivus, y’all!
My favorite part is that disputing a statistical descriptor of population that is being inaccurately used as a predictor of health means that WE DON’T RECOGNIZE THE MEDICAL PROFESSION.
My favorite part is that disputing a statistical descriptor of population that is being inaccurately used as a predictor of health means that WE DON’T RECOGNIZE THE MEDICAL PROFESSION.
I have to admit he’s right, actually. If I ran into the medical profession on the street, I might very well mistake it for, say, the legal profession.
Oh dear.
Jim, first off, this project isn’t actually saying anything about mortality rates. It’s saying here are some people, what they look like, and what BMI category they are in. To give us all a realistic picture of what all that looks like.
Gee, the nerve of a bunch of people of different body sizes and types to anabashedly SHOW themselves.
Second, the medical community itself is producing the studies that show everything we talk about in this blog. But the money that pays for the messages YOU apparently hear is coming from – you guessed it – the diet industry.
Third, every single study I have read shows:
1. fitness is a good predictor of mortality. weight is not, except when you’re a little “underweight” or extremely “obese”. In any case difference in mortality that correspond to different BMIs are statistically negligable compared with, say, how I’m likely to live much longer than you because I’m a woman and women live longer than men. (Studies on animals show that castration lengthens life in males. Perhaps you should try that of you’re so interested in longevity.)
2. the “overweight” category is the one associated with the lowest mortality. (some in the medical community react by saying overweight people are still at risk cuz they might BECOME obese. so apparently it’s best to be thinner and already be in the category with higher mortality, so that we wont be at risk of getting into a category with higher mortality. ya. makes sense.
others react by saying well mortality isn’t everything. ya. funny how that only comes up when they see that “overweight” is associated with the lowest mortality.)
3. this one is KEY: whatever the category associated with the lowest mortality – there is NO evidence that becoming fatter (if you’re under that “ideal” weight) or thinner (if you’re over it) causes you to acquire the health characteristics of those who are naturally at that weight.
one big reason that there is no evidence for that is that no large group of people has been found that has successfully permanently changed their weight (up or down) from where it naturally is when they aren’t trying to influence it.
tell men live longer than short men. does that mean stretching men to make them taller will make them live longer? why don’t u try it and let us know how it works out.
*oops i meant “tall men”. doh.
According to some evidence in animals, perhaps tall men who are castrated would live the longest… interesting.
Hey, thanks for the Festivus present. I’ll answer cggirl’s reply since she has the most coherent points.
Fist, let me say It is really nice to get three slow pitches in a row.
From Ageing Research Reviews, Volume 1, Issue 4, September 2002, Pages 673-691, Longevity, mortality and body weight notes that excess body weight takes life off of you at the rate of -0.4 years per kilogram.
And yes, they did use body mass. And yes, they used physically fit people. And yes, they noted that larger-framed people suffered more. So if you are tall, then you might want to actually be on the low side of the normal range, not on the high side, because your weight is high to begin with.
And this is just one study- if you would like more recent reporting there is the U.N. report on diet and disease as well as the National Geographic special report on longevity. Or take a look at anything by John Robbins, among others.
-jim
Jim, BMI was invented in the Victorian era by a Belgian statistician, not handed down to Moses on Mount Sinai by the Big Guy Himself. Assuming it had even been devised as some kind of means to measure health in the first place, it is simply not relevant to society two centuries on. We are larger all told – as in taller, broader, better off nutritionally than we were then. Furthermore, some bright spark deciding to lower the cut-off point determining who was overweight 150 years down the line rendered millions previously considered a healthy, desirable weight by your all-knowing, never prejudiced, mates, the medical establishment, overweight overnight. Not only did this create the spurious ‘epidemic’ our various governments are publicly wringing their hands about, it also widened the gulf between Victorian society and our own even further. BMI is an arbitrary, essentially flawed, archaic load of old twaddle that can’t differentiate between fat and muscle mass. It is a wholly unreliable indicator of health.
And just how much “excess body weight” takes life off of you at the rate of -0.4 years per kilogram, may I ask? Are we talking ounces, pounds, stones, tons? I believe true giants don’t live very long but giants aren’t any more typical of run-of-the-mill society than the half-ton-man invariably wheeled out as sure proof I’m going to peg it before you do – a fact, incidentally, I’d hotly dispute since female longevity tends to run in my family, fat notwithstanding.
But here’s the thing, Jim, life isn’t a competition to see who can live longer than who. And like it or not, we’re all going to die, you included, regardless of what you eat, how much you weigh or how much you exercise. Me, I’m for quality of life and the quality of mine has improved immeasurably since I stopped beating myself up for being fat.
Fist, let me say It is really nice to get three slow pitches in a row.
And yet…. whiff.
Me, I’m for quality of life and the quality of mine has improved immeasurably since I stopped beating myself up for being fat.
Nononononon, buffpuff. The correct response is to thank Jim for his concern and immediately stop being fat at him. After all, he took some his precious time to come to a fat acceptance site and set us all straight. The least we could do is stop accepting out bodies and devote our lives to fighting biology.
You’re right, Sniper. Jim is in fact the very embodiment of Christmas Spirit, what with the sharing and caring and all. I should learn to be more gracious. And illogical. Hey, there’s my new year’s resolution right there!
Oh, and can I also just point out — as I’ve probably already done on this thread — how much I love it when people scoff that this project is “just anecdotal”? As if my intention was to pass a Flickr photostream off as a rigorous scientific study?
[...] Kate Harding’s BMI project taught us anything, its that we can’t rely on this poor excuse for a medical tool to [...]
Buffpuff, you kick so much ass, it’s a wonder there’s any ass left when you’re done.
(of course that’s strictly anectdotal evidence on my part.)
Oh, I’m so glad Jim came back to give us more to work with, I was getting worried that his original comment was too flat-out dumb to be much fun.
Why thank you, buttercup.
*blushes*
Hey, uh, Jim, not to discount your (single) reference as (necessarily) biased, but the promo copy for this publication includes this: “The cellular and molecular underpinnings of manipulations that extend lifespan, such as caloric restriction, are being identified and novel approaches for preventing age-related diseases are being developed.”
I find it (more than) slightly possible that maybe there’s an agenda behind the framing of the results of the particular study you have referenced, though I will admit I haven’t yet found it online to review thoroughly.
Don’t suppose you have a backup study to reference?
P.S. The “medical establishment” has a pretty questionable track record. Malpractice insurance is crazy expensive for a reason.
But you guys! Jim has a vaguely worded statistic! I TAKE BACK EVERYTHING I’VE EVER SAID ON THIS BLOG.
*Is fat at Jim*
Jim,
First of all you describe “3 slow pitches” but u completely ignore that last point, which i find particularly important – the one about how whatever mortality is found among the naturally thin or fat or what have you, there is no evidence that purposely trying to influence weight will cause people to acquire the health characteristics of a person who naturally has the weight/BMI in question.
You also fail to realize the first thing i mentioned – that the BMI project isn’t trying to “prove” any of this stuff. It’s just showing what people look like at different BMIs.
Also, I fully agree with Tari about studies… and of COURSE i can’t possibly have read and reviewed every single study out there. But for what it’s worth, there is an overhwleming amount of evidence in the actual studies showing how little it matters if ur fat or thin and how the “overweight” category is, if anything, associated with the longest life. Oftent he results get totally mangled in the media. I keep finding more and more studies such as this one:
http://junkfoodscience.blogspot.com/2007/11/fat-and-long-life-obesity-crisis-is.html
That’s just one example but that blog shows how commonly results of studies are misrepresented.
In fact that blog probably references your own favorite studies and what it ACTUALLY shows versus what the researches have to pretend it shows in order to get more grant money and justify their existence..
And if u ask urself why things are misrepresented – the answer is simple. “Obesity” researches need to keep the idea going, the idea that obesity is bad, because that’s how they get more grants for studies from – guess who – the diet industry.
That blog – junkfoodscience – is just one source of course. There are many sources for this information.
Again, I’m not sure any of that is even relevant because it doesn’t show how purposely changing your weight might influence ur mortality. Namely, because there are no statistically significant groups of people who manage to do it. And even fewer people who do it without anorexia or bulemia or a horrible disease that emaciates them, or some such thing.
Jim I used to think like you as well, honestly. It took a long time for the overwhelming evidence to finally click with me. So I understand that things we commonly hold as true are very difficult to shake. Therefore, I sincerely doubt that I’m changing ur mind about anything.
Which leads me back to – the BMI project is pictures of some people at some weights. Why on earth would u find THAT objectionable?
Hmm.. I suddenly have an urge to post pictures of myself in a bikini all over the web and be fat at everyone. :)
(argh. as usual i cringe at all my mistakes and typos but y’all get what i’m saying.)
and shinobi and sniper – LOL! :)
incidentally Jim the only reason my responses seem more in depth than some others is that these lovely readers here have already gone into this so many times. and kate herself has a whole section on it.
i’m just repeating what they already know and have said a thousand times. and they know they can’t force u to further educate urself on these issues and question the commonly held beliefs and stigmas so they don’t bother…
i’m not sure why i’m bothering. it’s certainly not christmas spirit because i’m a huge jew.
Oh thank GOD! Someone has the sense to stand up to the nonsense (and no sense) that is the BMI scale!
Too lazy to figure out body fat percentage! No consideration for muscle mass or bone density.
Obviously a system invented by professional administrators, not biologists.
Why hasn’t this been trashed yet? We were better off with the old life insurance height/weight scales.
Brilliant! Thanks for putting the photostream up and having this discussion going.
Anyone remember the “Guess your weight” carnival game? I always love playing that one, b/c I always stumped the game owner. I’m 5′2, US size 10, and weigh 170lbs. I think the highest guess I’ve ever gotten was 140lbs. Yet according my BMI, I’m obese. Funny, I just thought I was athletic. :-)
Too often, fat is looked as this horrible specter that automatically makes your life a nightmare.
Increased fat is associated with health problems, such as cardiovascular disease, as mentioned earlier in the comments. But like most things in life, there’s negatives and positives.
Women with more body fat have more natural estrogen post-menopause, as fat tissue is a source of estrogen. Heavier people are less likely to get osteoporosis for a host of reasons, including the increased hormone production and the fact that increased weight makes the skeleton stronger in response. A lack of body fat will affect fertility and stop menstrual cycles, as the body will think that there isn’t enough resources to ensure a proper pregnancy.
But that’s reality. Too bad it’s so much easier to say (and spin) “fat=bad; no fat=good” instead of teaching moderation and showing that everything has two faces. But that’s a lot more words and not as “sexy”, eh?
[...] Kate Harding’s blog “Shapely Prose” and these two posts were just brilliant. BMI Project On Being a No-Name Blogger Using Her Real [...]
Oh my god, Victor, are you fucking serious?? THERE ARE FAT PEOPLE IN SOME OF THOSE PICTURES? Kate, we’re doing this all wrong! VICTOR SAW SOME FAT PEOPLE!
I know I should stop approving comments whose sole content is “you guys, you know that slide show where people are labeled overweight, underweight, normal, and obese? Well I think some of them are overweight, underweight, normal, and obese.” But I just find it so terminally funny when someone feels the need to comment on a blog ABOUT FAT to tell us that WE ARE FAT.
God, we need BMI Project Bingo. Victor’s going to come back and tell us that this isn’t a scientific study and we should have been more objective. And then I’m going to ban him.
Dude, BMI Project Bingo would be brilliant.
Victor is like the woman on “Don’t You Realize that Fat Is Unhealthy” who said that we must not have been talking about fat people, because they are unhealthy.
I know I should stop approving comments whose sole content is “you guys, you know that slide show where people are labeled overweight, underweight, normal, and obese? Well I think some of them are overweight, underweight, normal, and obese.”
Yeah, especially because I keep deleting them before I realize you’ve responded! :)
Clearly I am several times more pugnacious than you are.
Clearly I am several times more pugnacious than you are.
This week, anyway.
Yeah, and last week (or at least last month) I was probably the one going “oh my god I never want to hear negative shit from anyone again.” It just goes in phases. No idea why my dander is up right now, honestly.
[...] Beautiful photographs of really fat girls naked? Check. Promoting health at every size, including de-constructing the BMI and other fat myths? Dream on! Oh Body Drama, you came close, but not close enough to getting [...]
bmi is pretty bullsh*t on the skinny end too.
i’m 5′6″, and between 100-105lbs. this makes me apparently seriously underweight but i have NO health problems and killer stamina. i out-eat my husband [who is, to be fair, also really thin, but his bmi comes out as normal], and can lift much more than i weigh.
i have itty-bitty part-asian bird bones, i guess. my sister is a couple inches shorter and about 90lbs, and my brother is about 6′ and a whopping 145.
none of us are at risk of starving to death. we are too in love with krispy kreme.
Great site — more, more, more! (I love the idea of “what X lbs looks like.)
A recent article from the NYT talks about how not smoking, not drinking too much, eating enough fruits and vegetables, and getting some exercise contribute to longevity. This sentence struck me as really important, and supports the “anecdotal” evidence that commenters have given about healthy obesity:
**”The benefits were also seen regardless of whether or not people were fat and what social class they came from. “**
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/world/AP-Britain-Live-Longer.html?_r=1&oref=slogin
It is totally ridiculous the unfortunate thing is that soo many people buy into it. I wish we had the money to make this ad that we could broadcast widely.
I’ve seen it a few times and it still makes an impression.
One of my friends on Livejournal included a link to this and I found it amazing. I always knew how useless BMI was, but didn’t realize how much so until I saw it. According to BMI, I am “obese”, and 1.3lbs from “morbidly obese” and I have to lose 25 lbs to be “normal”… I wish I could send in a picture so you could see how screwed up it is! LOL! All the women in the slide show are beautiful!
As others have said, awesome slide show. Thank you. But
I have a question about the Flickr site — am I missing the
category labels? My apologies; I hate to put it that way. But
it helps to recognize that the same labels encompasses so
many different sizes and shapes. I’m trying to educate my-
self as fast as I can.
Thank you.
StarWatcher, when you go to the Flickr site, click on “View as Slideshow,” then when the show comes up, click on the first picture you see. It will start showing comments that include height, weight, BMI, and concordant BMI category. Hope that helps!
Thank you.
is there any way we can submit photos and BMI rates to be included in the slideshow?
[...] There is some seriously interesting research out there, including this study on BMI (Body Mass Index) that just totally blows my mind. I always thought BMI was bunk. This explains why the weight the BMI chart tells me is healthy for me is one I’ve only ever been able to achieve by near starvation and the weight I actually feel healthy at (almost fifteen pounds heavier!) is veering into the unhealthy range by those standards. Had I know this I could have spared myself numerous anxiety attacks wondering what a person who runs, kickboxes, does yoga and eats a mostly vegetarian diet could be doing wrong in order to be so unhealthy. Apparently, lots of other women who look and feel healthy have the same problem! [...]
I’m new to this blog, and it is amazing. This project really opened my eyes – I think all of the women, men, and cats involved look great! I have a feeling I will be coming back to this site constantly in the next few months, just to keep my sanity. Because you know its a crazy world when I can be preparing to graduate college summa cum laude, while holding down a job, and doing community theatre, but when my amazing fiancee (who loves me the way I am, thinks diets are stupid, and tells me I’m sexy) proposed my first thougt was ” Oh crap, I have got to lose at least 50lbs or I’m going to ruin my wedding day and entire marriage”. Thanks for at least opening my eyes to the craziness. You guys are GREAT!!!
PS – Apparently I’m almost “morbidly obese”
Kate,
Love your website! I own a small pilates/yoga studio and I am thrilled with your words of wisdom. Everyday I find myself educating clients that being “overweight” is not unhealthy. Keep shining your light of beautiful truth.
ps. Do I have your permission to add your web address to my resources page?
Sure, Sandra. Thanks.
Wonderful slide show!!
Do you have room for a picture of a 4′11″ 125 lb almost 39 year old whose doctor keeps pushing teh weight loss?
Fab stuff. I’m 4ft 11″ with a BMI of 31. Fuck it!
[...] reflect some uniform standard of “obesity” very well — see Shapely Prose’s BMI Project for proof of [...]
[...] Here is my message to Mayor Cornett: Diets Don’t Work. And the BMI is a joke. [...]
[...] in Mississippi have proposed legislation to prohibit restaurants from serving food to “obese” people. If you don’t believe me, look here. Everyone should be concerned, not just [...]
Great project!
I’m 5′4″ and 165 lbs. I work out several days a week, I’m training for a triathlon, and I have killer legs. It is completely ridiculous that I am a mere 10 lbs from being considered “obese”. I have never been happier with my body! While I do plan on losing some more body fat through my training, I know I’ll still remain upwards of 150lbs and still be completely healthy (and hot!).
This is so nice to see. I have been so depressed about my BMI lately. I am 5′4″, I weight 153lbs and, according to the personal trainer at my gym, my BMI is a massive 35, meaning, I believe, that I am severly obese. My blood pressure is consistently excellent, I have the lowest cholestrol my doctor has seen in a while (his words!). I could do with going to the gym more and toning up, but I am having a serious problem with hating my body since I found out my BMI. I need to read here more, and hopefully it will help. I think I look a little overweight, but how can 153lbs be severly obese??
and by the way, I really envy and appreciate all of you that have such a healthy view of your body. It is really inspiring, and I hope to get there soon ;) I’m 34 so I should be ok by now!
lucy, your BMI is about 26. Your trainer is lying to you, in a BIG way, which is pretty disgusting.
Good catch, apricotmuffins — Lucy, I’m sorry I missed your comment. To put it in perspective, I’m 5′2″ and 185 lbs., and my BMI is only 33.8.
You need a new trainer.
Oh, hey, Lucy, I’m 34 too and I just learned about body acceptance. Yeah, we all “should be ok by now,” but we’ve all been forcefed some pretty fucked up stuff. And I’m not talking about baby donuts.
Also BMI is an insanely inaccurate measure of not only your health but your worth.
[...] I’m on my way to that website now. [NOTE: I referred her to Kate’s BMI Project post] [...]
[...] an indicator of whether a particular person’s weight is healthy or not, have a look at this BMI slideshow (via Shapely Prose.) The Flickr set is interesting [...]
[...] The BMI Project [...]
Thanks for putting this together. Shows how we all are differently shaped and proportioned. Great job and thanks to those who donated their pictures.
Great slide show! So, if we can all see that BMI “measurement” is bollocks than what does that do to the governments contention that a large number of the population is obese? For that matter, the scientific papers that only used height and weight (BMI) in historical studies that looked for links to obesity and cancer, heart disease etc. I suggest that they need to look a lot deeper in those studies because it is not enough to just say “Oh, those people died because their BMI was high”. Um, I’m pretty sure that people with low BMI’s get cancer and heart disease too! In fact, I haven’t seen anything that shows a definite link between high BMI *only* and heart disease or cancer….I think there is something more specific going on that causes heart disease and it is found in both low and high BMI’s. I guess what I’m saying is that the BMI is inadequate, possibly even useless and should not be used.
I brought this up on another message board that I frequent where there had been discussion of BMI and I showed pics of myself and then told them that according to the BMI calculator I was obese. Nobody believed it. My own Dr. doesn’t believe it and is not telling me “OMG, you must lose weight” (thankfully, she is an enlightened Dr but there are many who are not!)
This website actually got me to cry a little – I’m 5′6.5″ and weigh 211 pounds currently. I have a BMI of 33.5 according to that. I’m dealing with recovering from ED-NOS, and this has been bookmarked as something really important to remember.
Thank you for making this.
[...] Great, that’s what we need: an even tighter ‘crack-down’ on our smallest jiggle. For those of “normal” BMI who could have a “risky” amount of fat, check out the BMI Project. [...]
This is no troll. I don’t know where to begin. I’m a college student with a history of anorexia, so I know that I have skewed perceptions of ‘the right weight.’ In my recovery I learned that I can’t pay attention to what I eat at all or I am prone to start skipping meals again. Recently I did get on a scale and when I found out my bmi was “all the way up” to 23.4, I cried for almost an hour. So that’s one half of my interest in this.
The other comes from the fact that my campus has experienced some hate crimes against homosexuals in the last week. t’s also gotten me to think a lot in terms of my own prejudices. I realized that I have been harboring one sort of rather overwhelming prejudice that I’ve never voiced (properly anyway) for fear of getting ostracized from many of my friends. I am terribly bigoted against fatness. I’ve been aware of my aversion for a while, but always been able to wave it away as a ’silly’ thing, my ‘fatism-haha’ and never thought deeply about it. I noticed a few days ago, on a friend’s facebook page that she joined a group of Kate Harding fans. I had no idea who she was, and did some investigating. When I logged onto this page and found out she was a fat activist, the disgust and feeling of ‘oh get over yourself .. you can ‘fix’ your ‘problem’ slapped me in the face and all of a sudden I understood I sounded JUST like a homophobe–something I abhor.
I then realized that I harbor a lot of those same feelings of disgust deep down for some of the people I care most about. Or worse, I “forgive” them, in particular, because they’re my friends, but I know I would judge them if I ran into them on the street. Its the exact same thing that one of my friends does to me; he tries his damndest to ignore the fact I’m bisexual in order for us to remain friends. I knew all of a sudden exactly how it felt to be one of those people. It was such a jarring moment. All of a sudden I was more empathetic to the criminals. You’re not proud of your bias (necessarily, some people are); it fact it can make you feel awful. I don’t know what I’m going to do now; I’m not there yet, but I know I need to come clean to my friends that I’ve marginalized.
Does anyone have advice for someone like me? I’m trying to change my perspective, but it’s hard. I should be in the perfect position to understand that not everyone can or should pursue society’s image of what’s right (or in my case, my own) but it’s not clicking.
missm, that’s a tough one, and we’re probably not qualified to answer it. That’s code for “you should probably talk to a therapist about it” — because I’d guess that it’s almost certainly tied to your ED history and whatever is at the root of that. Then again, we do have some therapists floating around here, so maybe they’d be able to point you in the right direction. It seems to me like something you just have to work through with someone who is qualified to help you dig into these issues without judging you, but without letting you off the hook.
missm, Sarah in Chicago recently did a post on Shakesville about trying to come to terms with her own prejudice — except in her case, the prejudice is against bisexuals. She has lots of great insights and the comments there are full of lots of great advice. Since you know what it’s like to be hated for being bi and have already made the connection there, reading that thread and thinking about it in light of your own views on fat could be helpful.
missm, in addition to what FJ and Kate have said, it might help you to dig through our archives and read some of the posts detailing what it feels like to be on the receiving end of fat prejudice. You can also check out First, Do No Harm to see what institutionalized fat prejudice looks like (though there are some anorexia/ED stories on there that might be triggering for you — I’m not sure). Either way, I encourage you to stick around here, read the archives, listen to what people have to say about what it’s like to be fat.
I think its awesome that missm has the courage to post that comment here. Just saying – thankyou for showing us that we are opening peoples eyes. It means a lot to me (even though i never blog, im just a tag-a-long) and im sure its encouraging to all the fatosphere bloggers.
thanks all for putting me right about my BMI. My trainer told me that the way he calculated my BMI (with callipers) was more accurate than me just reading my weight and height on a chart and calculating it that way. Is this BS then?
By definition, the BMI is ONLY calculated by weight and height. Caliper testing is almost always for body fat percentage, and a 35% body fat is not unheard of in females of childbearing age.
missm, thank you for having the courage to post your comment! i don’t know about more regular contributors, but i personally find it extremely encouraging that 1) kate’s blog is attracting attention from people who would otherwise dismiss fatness as a problem to “get over”, and 2) that the bmi project, the blog, and everything else has challenged your perceptions! that’s fantastic! i don’t know how one goes about modifying deeply held biases, but i would imagine that your revelation is a huge step in the right direction. and, indeed, i would venture to suggest that the fact that your friends are still your friends–despite their sizes and your admitted bias–suggests that maybe you aren’t as bigoted as you think you are!
even as a fat person, i have had a long-standing knee-jerk aversive reaction whenever i see another fat person. i read somewhere a long time ago that a useful exercise is to try and think of at least one positive thing about the appearance of every person you see, no matter how minor. eventually you become aware of the snap judgements you are making, which doesn’t necessarily change your opinion but at least brings it to your attention where you can challenge it if you want.
good luck!
[...] what’s my point, you may be asking. Kate Harding’s BMI Project has attracted the attention of a national women’s magazine who wants to feature body-positive [...]
I like your slideshow. I am also one of the people that fits into the overweight category (my pic is on my profile). I am training for the Country Music 1/2 marathon, and I work out 4 days a week. I feel healthy and fit, but being in that overweight category still bugs me. It’s nice to see beautiful women in all categories.
I’m definitely bookmarking this slideshow. I’ve always thought the BMI was completely worthless. I’m heading into medical school soon, and I know I won’t be using it as a deciding factor for ANY patient.
I myself generally come from Nordic/Celtic ancestry. Those vikings weren’t exactly dainty. Along with my permanently blinding white skin, blonde hair, and blue eyes, I’m very solidly built and muscular at 5′6″ & 200 lbs. I also have a 30DDD bust and a big butt to match. I always run when taking stairs if people are out of my way and I can also bend backwards while standing to touch my head to my heels.
My grandmother was known for going to carnivals and never losing at those weight guessing games. Those guys tend to be eerily accurate, but they where always about 40 lbs too low since she only looked like she was about 90 lbs. She looked like a stiff breeze could have knocked her over.
And yes, gym class was hell.
[...] it seems that we managed never to link to Kate Harding’s BMI Project slideshow, although I’ve been aware of it for months. If you still harbor some vague sense that all [...]
[...] Shapely Prose: The magazine that’s working on reproducing Kate Harding’s BMI project is still actively looking for more women of color and women in their 40s and 50s to submit photos. [...]
[...] Minute 2. Scene: A recent appointment with a new gynaecologist, and we get to talking about the BMI standards. [...]
[...] helpfully points out above) and I fit neatly into the ‘overweight’ category of BMI (as do many other healthy, normal people) Muscle weighs more than fat so if you are even remotely active in an organised way it will skew [...]
[...] Please see this. [...]
I am “obese.”
I work out 6 days a week.
My resting heartbeat is that of an athlete.
I wear a size 8.
Yeah, I not only work-out 5-6 days a week, eat lean and generally avoid junk, I had a screening yesterday, and although my real body fat percentage is 22% (7 caliper measurement process), my BMI is btwn 25-26% (Overweight). What a bunch of Hooey! Oh and I wear a size 4 btw! What the hell is wrong with these people? It really got my goat yesterday!!! Sorry for all the exclamation points…but I work my butt of to be healthy and the standards that are set are ridiculous.
The worst part is that the screening is for my health insurance premiums at work…how dare they use such archaic methods to measure me by.
[...] Kate Harding: BMI Project [...]
I’ll add a picture as soon as I get some, I don’t have any where I’d be sort of normally visible and some funky self-portrait like left hand photographing the right one is no good.
I’m in the overweight range and call me a troll or not, I want to be like 15 kilos lighter – gained these as a side effect of antidepressants and it doesn’t feel like me.
I have one little story to share, though. My mother seems to have anorexia by proxy. I’ve been listening all my life how fat I am, how fat I’ll be if I don’t stop eating that much, that I would maybe even look quite pretty if I only had a bit of strong will and lost 20 kilos – this being said when I did damn lot of dance and could be barely any leaner. I have a heavy frame and wide shoulders and apparently my mother thinks wide silhouette = big = fat = obese, will die soon in pains. The other day I was told that I should deal with my obesity. I asked wtf and was explained that I must have at least 105 kilos and that it is obese indeed and that being obese means that I’ll sweat,stink, look awful and people wouldn’t like me. I was around 85 kilos then. I didn’t say anything because I found out that with this point of view, there’s nothing to be done. I only discovered that my mother is talking total crap when she said the numbers and when I calculated that if she says I could look pretty with around 50 kilos, it means that to get her appreciation, I’d have to starve myself to death. Still, years of working on my self-esteem took its toll on, erm, my self-esteem. Only when I started dancing (being told that I’m stupid to play ballerina when I’m old and useless for serious dancing and that I should find some real workout) I discovered that my body is something else than an ugly sack of fat. Sigh.
[...] dell’indice di massa corporea (BMI). Quello che non ti dice è che sei bello. La blogger Kate Harding ha raccolto un’enorme quantità di fotografie a dimostrarlo. Se volete calcolare il vostro [...]
THANK YOU
finally someone pointed out that BMI hates skinny people too. i’m 101 (on a good day) and 5′5″ I eat FINE my doctor constanly reassures me i’m not underweight, but according to my bmi reading i’ve got one hell of an eating disorder.
thank you thank you thank you for showing that curvy people can be beautiful without bhating on the skiiny ones.
Even after losing 50 pounds, my BMI is in the “you are going to die tomorrow” category.
How do I contribute a photo?
Also, I’m going to interject that the fat side of my family has some serious longevity. My grandfather died a week shy of turning 89 and my grandmother just passed in March and would have been 88 last week.
But you know, OMG teh fattyz are going to die young.
Quote: #
Rebecca, on April 18th, 2008 at 2:00 pm Said:
…but I work my butt of to be healthy and the standards that are set are ridiculous.
The worst part is that the screening is for my health insurance premiums at work…how dare they use such archaic methods to measure me by.”
One surprising thing I heard recently is that the BMI was tightened up recently (I am not sure how recently) so that fewer people are in the normal and more are defined overweight. I am still trying to figure out why they would do that, with all of the yawning lack of evidence that fat is the devil.
every picture is beautiful, I loved watching the slideshow.
Cassie’s picture is sexy, I must say, and the last one of Kate exercising is the other favorite, strength beautifully captured on camera.
They are all so real and I wish there were more pictures like these all over the internet and magazines of what women really looked like.
I’m currently in BMI hell. I do weigh a little more than I would like to, but I eat (usually) healthy and take care of myself. From years of competitive Irish dance, and then a college on the side of a mountain, my legs are mostly muscle. There’s definitely chub on me, but it’s mostly confined to my thighs, butt, and D-cup boobs. All in all, I think I’m reasonably healthy, and bloodwork confirms. My BMI is currently 31.
According to a doctor at the VA hospital in DC, I am “too fat for the Peace Corps, and should join weight watchers.” Purely based on my BMI, said straight to my face when she can SEE that I’m otherwise healthy, having just done my physical. I’ve never had someone tell me I was fat before, and it was really hurtful.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hergrace/2284439109/
That’s me with my dad. Apparently I’m obese. I always knew BMI was stupid, but I never realized how emotionally damaging it could be.
This is me:
http://pics.livejournal.com/emmelinemay/pic/004gqedz/g2
My BMI is 27 – so I’m overweight. O_O
[...] complaint is that it relys on BMI to determine your fitness level and BMI is pretty much a load of crap. It also uses the adult BMI chart for children, which means even more skewed results for [...]
[...] here to check out the amazing slideshow and tell me what you think. Did You Enjoy this Post? Subscribe to Finally Getting Fit. It’s Free! [...]
I’ve been wrestling with the fact that though I fit the same size clothes as a friend of mine but I weigh 40 lbs heavier! It just doesn’t make sense… I’ve been looking for height/weight images of real people and this page was really great to view. Thanks so much for making it. The diversity is as beautiful as the BMI is shady. I also loved the little bit of queer visibility with Teh Portly Dyke’s pseudonym. Yay for dykes taking up space (pun, ha!) on the web!
Keep up the good work.
I have a BMI of 40 and am training to run my first 5K in September.
Yeah, OMG, teh fattys, dey runz!
I’m “morbidly obese” in a size 18. By my calculations I’d have to lose 68 pounds to be simply “overweight” and 98 pounds to be “normal.”
Me: http://i290.photobucket.com/albums/ll257/profoundsarcasm/DSC03573.jpg
I’d really like to get in touch with the poster Ali just above – but she is probably long gone. I was in the Peace Corps with a BMI of probably around 35 or so…it meant I had to get some extra medical tests but they accepted me with no problem. There were a couple of other girls who also had to have those tests, and one of them was significantly thinner than me. I don’t think you can be too fat to be in Peace Corps, but it was hard for me to make the decision to apply because I was afraid of really sticking out as a fat person in some area where people are undernourished and therefore hardly anyone is fat. And also, I was afraid … of confirming everyone’s prejudices that Americans are all fat. Seriously, we had one volunteer who was told by the locals that she couldn’t be American because she was thin.
[...] my weight to be taken at a doctor’s office). We don’t know what weight looks like, we really really don’t. And as we in the Size Acceptance and Health at Every Size world know, there is no number, be it [...]
I found this article thoroughly enjoyable…
It’s amazing how we can be labeled one way just by a measurement…
It really doesn’t speak to a person’s actual look and health.
Sheesh. This was really eye-opening…
[...] Kate Harding’s BMI Project ~ Ever wonder just how skewed those ridiculous BMI standards are? View the slideshow of real people, who fit the arbitrary categories from Underweight through Morbidly Obese. [...]
[...] puts me at serious risk of any number of health issues. Of course, we educated folk know the BMI is crap. Still, the prevailing position is that I should do something about [...]
Funny. My BMI is 33.7 and my boyfriend’s is 33.3. We are both “obese.” I wear an 18. He wears a 36-waist. We’ve both been ridiculed by people we consider friends over our bodies, and neither of us are happy or comfortable with it. We eat well and exercise when we can, and still, one of my friends doesn’t ant me to hug him because I would “crush him.”
[...] AsksMeFi permission to wear bathing suit. 10Jul08 While referencing Kate Harding’s BMI Project to describe her stature. And receives surprisingly humane responses. I will be [...]
hey everybody…it’s been a while since this was posted but I thought I’d share my story.
I remember I was a bit stockier when I was younger, and had a bit of trouble with my weight, but that was fixed with eating healthier.
middle/high school gym wasn’t too bad for me – I was a fairly “normal” size, and actually enjoyed sports and such, but those Physical Fitness Tests were horrible – I don’t have great arm or core strength so I stank at the sit ups and pull ups, and a medical condition means I can’t run for more than a few minutes without practically dying. Too bad they didn’t test leg strength, I would have blown everybody out of the water!…
in my teens I fenced a lot (5 days a week, 2 hours a day) and was prescribed Adderall for ADD, and this made me my skinniest. It kept my weight around 140-150 at 5′8″, which is in the “normal” range. However, I only got there by eating maybe 2 sandwiches a day, and doing a lot of exercise. That’s hardly healthy.
Over the summer before freshman year of college, I stopped fencing and taking my adderall, and went up to nearly 200 pounds. My doctor was confused, which made sense…but my mom’s reaction to it was the worst. She basically said “oh, she’s just this heavy because she’s not on the medication…once she’s on the Adderall again she’ll lose weight and be healthy again.”
um…what? First of all, what kind of message is that to send to your kid? It’s better to be medicated and thin than happy and healthy at a larger size? Nobody should need to take any pills or medication to lose weight. If you need to, then it’s really no point, because a) you probably shouldn’t be at that size anyway, and b) how will you keep it off when you stop the pills? because I was actually giving my body the food it needed, I may have gotten heavier, but I was also stronger (I wasn’t getting as tired as easily).
I’m now back to eating healthier and exercising, and have stayed the same weight, so I know that this is probably where I should have been all along. And the flickr picture set definitely helped to make me feel more comfortable about my body, and accept that I’m just built differently than some people. It’s been an issue I’ve dealt with since I was a kid (I remember worrying about my weight since I was in the single digits of age) but I’m starting to realize that hey, I’m healthy, and just because I’m bigger doesn’t mean I’m a bad person or anything like that.
So thank you very much for this whole project…I wish more people realized that you don’t have to be a size 2 (or 4, or 6, or any size) to be healthy and happy.
WOW. You MADE my YEAR.
I am so tired of this country’s views of women’s weight…and it is WOMEN.
I used to teach 8th graders in inner city middle schools…right around the time when size ZERO came out…I used to explain to my girls that this meant you were making it your goal to DISAPPEAR.
Through grassroots information sharing we can stop all this crap and really make a difference….tell a woman she’s beautiful today…just a random stranger…I do it all the time…
Thanks again.
Wow, I don’t feel so…wrong…being classified as “underweight.” I’m so tired of dr’s prescribing all sorts of “supplemental drinks” to try and get me into the “normal” rating. My body is apparently happy to be where it is thank you very much.
THANK YOU for putting this together, it is incredibly beautiful and poigniant. I can’t believe people tell me my daughter is “fat” between 6 months and 18 months. We are beautiful at all sizes!
Seeing this made my day. I think BMI is a depolorable “tool” for classification. There isn’t a one-size fits all measurement for bodies – sorry folks. True health is indicated by several criteria.
I applaud you!
if you ever open submissions, let me know…! this is wonderful. i hate the bmi standards because there is no room for larger framed people and smaller framed people and its just ridiculous!!!
Just wanted to add my thanks for this.
I was brought up to believe I was fat even before I was. My mother, bless her, has fat-hate even though she’s big herself. I learned not to listen, although it took me nearly 30 years.
I also wanted to add how photogenic all the participants are. It seems when you’re happy in your own skin you look better and you photograph well.
I just wanted to thank you for this wonderful and inspiring project! I came onto the web looking to discover my ideal weight and was buried in websites that suggested, according to my BMI, that I was “overweight.” I actually found your project via a link from an insurance newscast website. I was horrified and somewhat disgusted with myself when I found out I was “overweight” with a 25 BMI.
However, after looking at all the pictures of the beautiful women from your project I feel even prouder and more accepting of my body. I eat well, am physically fit, and have no medical conditions to report.
I felt GREAT about my body before I even came onto the web and I find it extremely disheartening to experience how fast and hurtful specific words and terms or measurement systems can cut into one’s confidence so fast. Thank you for this wonderful project that promotes the idea of healthy body images…keep up the great work!
[...] Harding of Shapely Prose has put together the BMI Project, with the intent of illustrating “just how ridiculous the BMI standards are”, as well [...]
[...] a gander at any of the links under the HAES section on this website. Check out Kate Harding’s project on the BMI index, or the don’t you realize fat is unhealthy [...]
[...] want BMI thrown out with the bath water. BMI is an antiquated, arbitrary, ridiculous standard to which no one should be accountable. It simply [...]
Shucks..I’m getting all teary eyed. This really put some things in perspective. My BMI is 22.1 (that is, if I round my 5′5 and a half frame up to 5′6. Lowering it to 5′5 increases my BMI significantly to a number, despite this awakening video, I still feel horrified disclosing.) and I found myself admiring the bodies of those who were considered “overweight” more often than those that were “normal”.
What the hell? Who propelled this stupid measure of health into popularity?
Last night I wore a real skanky dress. I was initially scared shitless when I realized there’s a little layer of fat covering my ribs (when the hell did that appear?) but I later decided it was cute, not gross.
The key is that there are many different body types.
One does not expect a Chihuahua to be like a Saint Benard, or a Basset Hound to be like a Greyhound, so why on earth are people expected to be all the same? (No, I am not comparing women to dogs, that was just an easy comparison of how different a species can look from one another, since most people are familiar with the different varieties of dogs.)
Look at the different body types on the athletes you see in the Olympics, and the different things they do because of the different body types. Then there are those that are doing the same things, that STILL have different body types, like the gymnasts.
Having variety in our body types is how we have survived for so long. It’s important to understand that we have developed for different climates, terrain, and cultures.
[...] envision the extreme end of the weight spectrum instead of understanding what certain BMI numbers actually look like. (Could they be getting that idea from the fact that the media accompanies most articles and news [...]
I love this, came across it by mistake on flickr I think… Do you know of any other art or project where people tackle the issue of obesity that I can look at? Thanks for your work, Lou
[...] a BMI between 30 and 40. Want to know what that looks like? Check out the BMI project’s slideshow and Flickr [...]
It’s strange…
I always thought I was overweight, and my bmi is 22 (well with in the normal range) and after looking at all of these people the ones who are normal look skinny and the ones who are overweight and obese look healthy.
It just shows that people (or at least I do) judge themselves to harsh.
I know for a fact that I am lacking in nutrients and without a doubt I could say that most of the girls who are overweight and obese are a million times healthier then me.
Yet muscle has a lot to do with it (it weighs twice as much as fat)
It’s disturbing to me that the difference between ‘normal’ weight and ‘obese’ is a mere 30 pounds.
Seems kind of silly… I could fluctuate that much over a couple of months!
Hello Kate,
I’m sorry I’m late to comment on this project. It seems to me that insofar as fascism might be defined as the intrusion of aesthetic categories into political discourse, we live quite literally in a “body fascist” society. The BMI categories are aesthetic ones, not medical ones; that much is clear. And to judge by the responses here, they’re not even the *right* aesthetic ones!
I wanted to know what you think about something that hasn’t I think received much airing in the comments so far (I scanned rather than read in detail). Some recent PSA campaigns in the UK have focussed on waist-hip ratio as a predictor of so-called obesity-related diseases such as type II diabetes. The available medical evidence seems to suggest that this (even cruder) calculation is a better predictor of these kind of health problems, though still scarcely perfect. I wanted to suggest that maybe the reason that people react with incredulity to the BMI categories you show in the slides is that the people photographed there, I think without exception and regardless of size, have a healthy-looking *shape*: that is, basically, a low waist-hip ratio. The “normal” and “underweight” people probably have some of the highest waist-hip ratios, and the “give ‘em a donut” reaction is probably translatable to “they look like they need more hip fat!” There are lots of issues that I’m interested in here, including the equation of fat with deformity, but I wonder if you had any thoughts…
Best wishes,
Lil
Hey,
I just happened by your site, and I’d like to tell you what a breath of fresh air it is!
I’m currently in the military, and I know the BMI matrix rather well, as I have to go through a taping, weigh in and other poking and prodding every six months.
I’m average size, but according to their standards I fall on the far end of obese. Nevermind the fact that I can run the mile and a half and stay neck and neck with young 18 year old men, or that I can do more push ups than them, or do the required amount of sit-ups times two…
I think that there’s a problem there. I have to bi-annually go into the medic and get a waiver, saying that I am healthy. I have no history of diabetes, thyroid issues or anything else, I just don’t seem to lose weight.
I’m rambling though, but I appreciate this blog very much. Like I said, coming from a world of tape and measurements, it is really good to know that there are people that appreciate people of all shapes.
Kudos to you all for upkeeping such a wonderful site.
-Corvis
[...] I have noticed more and more teens looking at the BMI Index which is ridiculous. I found this powerpoint that illustrates that point. I read a post by a teen today that shocked me. This person was ready to [...]
[...] do have important things to say and they cover their topic thoroughly. And kudos to them for the BMI Project, which features photos of many different women, including their BMI scores; they’re trying to [...]
AMAZING! I was a fat kid, then lost 5 stone in my early twenties. It’s a constant battle to keep it off, and I do go up when I relax. Found a happy medium where I don’t have to kill myself to stay skinny, and my weight doesn’t go into orbit when I have a weekend away. For some reason, when I’m heavier, I don’t put weight on so quickly.
Anyway babbling. At my ’slimmest’ (which was still heavy for someone of my height) I was 140 pounds and I’m 5′3”. But I was a size 10 (UK). I was happy with that! Buy my BMI was still high. I was pretty muscly then as did lots of weights and put it partly down to that, and partly down to the fact i’ll always be heavier than lots of other people my height, even though I was a size 10.
Now I’m a 14, and would be probably be classified as obese, or even morbidly! But I think I just look slightly heavier than average. I don’t mind. And my boyfriend doesn’t seem to mind at all, quite the opposite. I’ve learnt that my actual weight or BMI doesn’t mean I don’t look good, and stopped measuring myself against that. If I’m excercising and fit, and can wear the clothes I want to, I’m happy. I’ll always have to keep an eye on it and will always go up and down a little, but I’ve stopped comparing myself to 8 stone celebrities, it’s just not worth being miseable for! Hardly eating and excercising hours every day is not my idea of a fulflling life. Everyone’s different, as long as they feel happy, who the fuck else should care enough to comment on it? Bizarre attitude if you ask me.
Great site, really entertaining and makes many poignant, well points.
Bravo!
I have always thought that BMI was accurate, but looking at the pictures now, I really don’t think it is fair or accurate at all. There is a huge psychological difference between normal and overweight, yet on this system, it can be as little as 0.1 difference.
I think that because so many Americans are considered over weight that America has become so overly-conscious about body size and shape (according to statistics, I’m no so convinced that something like 60% of Americans are really over weight/obese ~ its probably based on this flawed system). Too much hype has been brought about by all of this.
Wonderful slideshow, thank you! Like Wendy Juniper, I’m short (5′ 2″), and according to the BMI standard am obese at 155#. But I’m robustly healthy, more so than my coworker who is much taller and the same weight. Even though I’d like to weigh less, my body seems to prefer to lurk at this weight. As long as I know what triggers jolt me into eating poorly, I stay at this weight. And since I exercise regularly and like the way I look (as does my husband), perhaps I can now work on accepting that face in the mirror.
I’ve always thought the BMI standards were ridiculous. I can’t believe how many normal looking people were labeled “overweight.”
[...] here to see an interesting slideshow about [...]
Wow. So many comments. I knew there’s something wrong with BMI standards. This is proof. It would’ve been great to see their actual weights, heights and BMIs, though.
But it’s a fantastic project and I’ve sent this link to many friends of mine. Thank you.
Rooi_Skoene, if you click through to the flickr pool, you do see all the stats.
Oh, that’s fabulous, Sweet Machine. Thank you.
Isn’t it crazy how we allow little numbers — IQ tests, anyone? — to rule our lives?
A good point here.
Hi. I’m a lingerie model signed by a large modeling agency. I fit into the usual sizes required of models of my type, and my BMI ranks 30 – apparently I’m obese.
My waist, incidentally, is 12 inches smaller than either my chest or my hips. And, though I have fat on my body, I do not have much, par indication of my chosen career.
yours,
-”obese”
[...] it’s cheaper!” they say) yet all of the actors and actresses in these commercials are what the infamous BMI would deem as “underweight”. Mixed messages, [...]
[...] BMI project slideshow on Kate Harding’s Shapely Prose (which is a good source overall for information dealing with body image and [...]
I must say that I nearly cried when I saw the pictures of the “morbidly obese” women. They are so beautiful. I fit in the same category, and I’m starting to think that I might be beautiful too…
[...] Cervical Awesomeness! 7 01 2009 Yes, I’m meant to be revising. And yes, this is the third post in two days. But not only have I suffered from blogging withdrawal, I’ve also been lucky enough to stumble across possibly the most interesting and wonderful set of photographs online, depending on where you rank the BMI project. [...]
[...] bypass candidates all fighting their way through the Golden Arches. But as Kate Harding’s BMI project reminds us, the numbers can be deceiving. Obesity is a rather vague term, conjuring up [...]
[...] the council has told him that his BMI is too high (over 40 – but we all know that BMI is a pile of horseshit!), and that the authorities therefore believe he will die, and so should not be allowed to [...]
[...] to the stats on this website, Megan Fox has a BMI of about 18.6. Salma Hayek, whose boobs Megan is so envious of, has a BMI of [...]
[...] and whether you compare me to 36-26-36 paradigm or to the generally medically accepted (although pretty stupid) BMI system, I don’t add up to the perfect woman. But this doesn’t mean no one wants [...]
http://www.nhs.uk/healthprofile/Pages/BMI.aspx
Apparently the BMI does take into account differences in body shape- surely the NHS wouldn’t lie or used flawed analysis, would they? However, when I used the calculator just now, it didn’t ask me anything about my body type (broad shoulders, wide bones at wrist and ankle) so I am wondering if- oh actually, it’s all bullshit!! According to this Evander Holyfield would have been in the overweight range (6′1″, 208lbs) in his light heavyweight days- and told by his doctors to lose weight no doubt!!
All of the people in the slideshow look beautiful, happy and healthy. Isn’t that good enough?
Chickfactor, the BMI formula is just that: a mathematical formula. There’s no room for information on body shape, age, gender, or anything else.
That’s insane!!! Like, wow. I mean, people who are exactly the same size fall into different categories? That’s ridiculous! I agree with Chickfactor, isn’t the fact that they look happy and healthy good enough?
Not for doctors I suppose, who like to blame everything on being overweight, including the sniffles.
This is a great project and I’m still busily spreading it on the net. Kudos for this one.
I have only just seen these pictures (I’m at work so the slide show wouldn’t work so I looked at the Flicr set instead), and I would like to just say WOW. These women look fantastic, and I again echo what everyone else here says, that the ‘overweight’ women look far from that. If I saw any one of them in the street, I would never think of them as being overweight in a million years. As someone who is new to FA, after years of dieting and gaining, standing currently between 225 and 260lbs at 5′9″, I have days where I love my fat body and days where I hate it. Today I have been having a hating day after being squashed on an airline seat just a couple of days ago. These pictures have reminded me again that I am normal. We are all normal. Our size does not change that. Stupid BMI can try, but it’s not going to beat me!
[...] in particular BMI is a load of rubbish [...]
Wow, I have been annoyed by the BMI-BS for some time. I am 5′9 170 lb male and I am considered overweight based on BMI. I have 52 inch shoulders and I wear 32 inch jeans. I have really modest bulk and eat healthy and excercise regularly and only hope to achieve “tone” in the gym. WTF is this based on? Concentration camp averages?
I am astounded by how ridiculous the BMI calculations are. Where I work, we are having our BMI as an “unofficial” rating that is being used to give us a discount on our health benefit payments.
However, I do not know how “unofficial” it is and it is being calculated in towards our discount.
I am 46 years old, 6′2″, weigh 225 pounds and stay in pretty good shape. I am listed as “overweight” and I am at the end that is approaching “obese”.
As much as I complain as a man, I am painfully aware of how women get the more scrutinizing spotlight.
I haven’t read through every single comment thoroughly, but something I’ve noticed that seems only to be addressed in passing is the fact that BMI is NOT the same as body fat percentage. BMI does not take into account body composition or build. Just as an example: I’m a 5′4″ woman with dense bones and a lot of muscle who, at 165 lbs still wears a size 8 or 10. Based on BMI, I’m overweight; based on body fat percentage, I’m not. I’m not necessarily saying that having a body fat percentage in a “desirable” range is reasonable for all people, just that it’s not the same as BMI. Not even close.
I am SO glad that you did this. I’m 5″2, with E cup breasts and I weigh 10 and a half stone. Apparently I am overweight and close to obese.. I’m 17, and I really worry about the way I look (Most teenagers do I guess! :P) But this just shows how stupid the BMI idea is! Thank you!
[...] (It would be a good idea, if any of this post comes as a surprise, to visit Shapely Prose. See especially this post, any other post marked Health at Every Size, and the BMI Project.) [...]
[...] 4, 2009 by angrygrayrainbows Last weekend, I was showing the bf the BMI Project to more completely illustrate to him what complete hooey BMI [...]
[...] like to argue against this article’s assumption and assert that since the visual reality of What is “Fat” would likely give a double-take reaction, let’s go out and say that No, actually, there are [...]
Wow, this really too me by the cuffs and knocked some sense to me. Yesterday- just yesterday, I said to my sister, I cannot wait until Im not obese anymore, and she said – you’ve lost a lot of weight, youre not obese anymore.
And I said, yes I am – the BMI indicator says so.
Because I’m used to allowing things that do not know me to pass judgement on me.
I’ve got to be tired of this by now. It’s outrageous.
As someone who has a BMI of 21.7 (dead centre, according to some scales!) and probably no muscle, I found this quite interesting. I think I’m one of the few people that the BMI is actually accurate about. My highest BMI was about 26.7 and I think somewhat overweight would have been a fair description for me at the time.
I see a some friends who look about the same as me or perhaps slightly bigger get classified as overweight or obese… and I always find it quite bizarre.
[...] you. So maybe you come to this site. Maybe you read about a project like Dare to Show Your Face or The BMI Project or The Fat Experience Project and you think “Well, I’m fat, and I guess my experience [...]
[...] to feminist blogs I read- oh, and links to Sarah Haskins lol), and one of the links I sent was Kate Harding’s illustrated BMI slideshow. I mentioned it again, and she said I could bring it up in class and show it. But if anyone has an [...]
[...] you. So maybe you come to this site. Maybe you read about a project like Dare to Show Your Face or The BMI Project or The Fat Experience Project and you think “Well, I’m fat, and I guess my experience [...]
[...] Also from Shapely Prose, the BMI Project. This slide show is a great way to visually critique the categories the Body Mass Index boxes [...]
You can’t imagine how shocked I was recently to discover that I’m at the absolute highest weight for my height to be considered “normal.” I’m glad to know I’m not the only one who, after looking at the number and then looking at my body, found the whole thing to be pretty ridiculous.
What about a person who weighs, say, 295 lbs and has approx. 5% body fat? The BMI would STILL claim I’m obese. Say WHAT? Mean to say that the only way I can be “healthy” is to be emaciated? Good grief. Who thought up THIS crap? More junk science from someone receiving a huge research grant, I suppose…
I hope people will respond to my comment and help me understand. I am so confused by the purpose of this project.
I’ve never read anything that said BMI was a concrete method of measuring “normal” body weight. It’s a guideline. Guidelines are generalities. Generalities do not apply to everyone, there are always exceptions.
I also don’t understand the insult behind the words overweight or obese. These are clinical/medical terms, with clinical/medical definitions. If they apply to you, then okay. What is the problem? (I would be considered “morbidly obese.)
The slide show above shows pictures of beautiful women, along with their weight classifications. When I say that I don’t understand the purpose, I mean that I don’t get what this is attempting to prove. Many of the women fit their classifications, this doesn’t make them any less wonderful. I’ve been reading several Fat acceptance blogs over the past few days, and something I’ve seen multiple times, is women embracing their size and self in real life. They’ll tell stories of friends who say, “Oh, you’re not fat”, and they’ll correct them, “Yes, I am”, and that is a moment of triumph for them, of accepting themselves. I feel like this slideshow, and the uproar against BMI is encouraging the opposite. It seems like I should look at these pictures, and think, “Oh, she’s pretty and interesting, she couldn’t be obese. That must be wrong.” Isn’t that the same logic well-meaning friends use when they say, “You’re not fat like them”?
If you truly love and accept yourself, why does it matter where you fall on a number scale? Why is it necessary to negate your placement or the validity of the system because it files you in a category you don’t like? If we are really accepting ourselves for who and what we are, why act as though a little(or big) number undermines everything we stand for?
MarlieNow, you’re missing the point. The point is that those BMI classifications are often the ONLY justification used when a person [usually a woman] is told ‘you must lose weight or you will die OMG NOW’. Regardless of health status, diet, lifestyle, muscle vs fat, anything else, if your BMI classifies you as obese in the eyes of the medical field, you must lose weight. You are not healthy. Heck, you’re barely even human.
It isn’t saying ‘no, they CAN’T be obese, they’re pretty!’ it’s ‘Look, they’re normal, but modern medicine is convinced they’re about to die. This isn’t right’.
Thanks for explaining. I understand where you’re all coming from a bit more.
I’m going to do more research on the subject. The only time I’ve heard BMI mentioned on my preferred news outlets, they were pointing out the flaws in the system. I don’t think the news programs I watch are that great, so I assumed that was common knowledge. But I know assumptions are often wrong, and I would like to be better informed.
Whats really interesting is that I pulled up these pictures as sort of a “how you you percive yourself” self-therapy, and I self-identified as looking like Fillyjonk and Sweet Machine’s pictures.
Not only are they both shorter than me, but they weigh at least 80 pounds more than I do. Perhaps I should explore this further.
These pictures would be so valuable as a poster! I would buy one for every girl I know!
[...] after reading Kate Harding’s Shapely Prose and seeing her BMI Project, I’m starting to wonder just how seriously I should take my doctor’s warnings. [...]
I have a fatal, progressive, neurodegenerative disease. My neuro is great about my weight, but other docs have acted like I should be on a diet. I feel like screaming” I’m going to freaking *die* you morons, so what if my BMI is 33. I’m sure it will go down rapidly when I am, oh, no longer able to swallow!” What is with the &%#! medical profession?
Great slide show!
[...] This is what it looks like. Morbid Obesity. Death Fat. A BMI over the recommended 25 or heck even the mildly less horrifying “Overweight” category limit of 30. This is woman at a BMI of 49.5. That’s almost 50! TWICE the maximum “Normal” size!!! Did you even know what it would look like? [...]
It’s very interesting to see. On both ends some of the underweight people don’t look so and some normal people do look it. It’s completely off on the overweight stuff on some people.
BMI is very inaccurate with health in general. I was very severly anorexic and I actually bloated up at my lowest weight so BMI did not state how bad the situation was. You could still see it was bad though because I just looked awful. They find with people starving in times of famine bmi is almost useless because of famine oedema. They have found the the people who come in with the higher bmi’s are more likely to die.
I also was in treatment where they would put everyone up to a 20 bmi and everyone looked totall different and some still looked really underweight.
[...] of it telling me ZOMG YOU’RE OBESE YOUR BMI SAYS YOU’LL DIIIIEEEEE. (See Kate’s BMI Project for a visual example of why the BMI is an arbitrary number that can, overnight, make you normal or [...]
Arnold Swartzenegger is morbidly obese according to the bmi. Swear to god.
[...] 1, 2009 One of my fave bloggers, MamaVision shared a link on her blog that I loved re: BMI. Click here, to check out Kate Harding’s a slideshow, the BMI Project, that proves just how ridiculous [...]
[...] The BMI Project – a slide show of images of women alongside their BMI category [...]
[...] assume that all fat people eat too much. They don’t account for the fact that people come in all shapes and sizes, and that a person’s weight is not an indicator of overall health. This comes at a good time, [...]
Dang, I just sent an email with my pic and bmi stats. Should’ve read the whole post first huh?
This project really saved me. I had just come home from the doctor where they told me that I am morbidly obese and will now have diabetes, heart attacks, strokes and die a horrible death. I wear a size 20 so now I’m going to die? Wha?
I went online looking for *anything* that could help me figure out why a number was telling me that I was a Dead Chick Walking.
Looking at all of the people- some even like me- helped me realize that it’s just a number. If my doctor can’t see past an antiquated and flawed system- then I need a new doctor.
Great project. I am 5.11″, weighing in at 210 LBs and according to the BMI measurement I am “over-weight” bordering on “obese”. I did laugh at that if you look at my body frame.
oh, my THANK you!
I’m 5′2″ (5′3″ on a good day) 165, and I wear a size 4/6 pant – however, at 165, I’m “obese”
When I was 140, I ” wore a size 0/2 pant (I could shop in the kids section), you could see my ribs and ab muscles… I was anorexicesque and not particularly healthy, and if I gained 1lb (which can be accomplished by a hearty breakfast), I would be “overweight”
I’ll have to revisit and read ALL the comments – but just wanted to say THANK YOU for this website!
Thanks to your interview on Q this morning, I’ve discovered this *amazing* blog!
I’m 5′2″ and weigh 140 pounds, making me overweight according to the BMI. This scale doesn’t care that I’ve got tons of muscle density for my height; instead, it says I need to lose 15-20 pounds before I can safely consider myself normal.
Thanks BMI, but no thanks.
According to the BMI I do believe at 5 feet and 132 pounds I am considered overweight. I was once sick and skinny, am now healthy and chubby. Would so much rather be chubby, happy and in perfect health… took me a long time to get here!
http://meghantelpnerblog.com/2009/05/12/id-rather-be-chubby/.
Awesome work!
Meghan
http://www.meghantelpner.com
http://www.makingloveinthekitchen.ca
I get your point of course, but half of the pics don’t show enough detail for us to really see anything. Also, how about putting the ’stats’ up on each picture so we can get an idea of the height to weight ratio? You’d have to change it from automatically advancing to clicking a ‘next’ button so we could have time to read and think. Otherwise, your blog here is very good. I’m a guy and I’m right on the border of ‘obese’ so it’s not just a female phenomenon. (By the way, ‘chubby’ F’s are very very sexy!) THANKS!
Hey there Kit Marlowe, if you click on the Flickr link, you will see all the stats, and you can go through the pictures at your own pace.
Thought you might get a kick out of this: http://www.cockeyed.com/photos/bodies/heightweight.shtml — I’m the 5′6″ 165 lb chick wielding the axe. LOL I love that page for getting a real sense of what real people look like.
Found this via the Internet somewhere… I’m not sure where.
Anyway, I’m 5′4, wear a North American 14/16 pant size (which is equally as useless as the BMI because sizing varies so much)… and have a BMI somewhere around 28-29.
But I’m physically healthy. I’m in shape. I walk, due to lacking a vehicle. (A trip to get my groceries is nearly a mile each way.) I don’t get winded going up stairs. Running is hard on my lungs due to breathing conditions I was born with, but I’d feel otherwise fine to run a bit. Not the stereotypical ‘fat chick’, eh?
For my height, I’m on a large frame – big hips, long torso, C/D cup breasts, North American size 9 shoe – and I don’t know that the BMI takes things like that into account. If I dropped down to 110-120, I think I’d feel skeletal.
I love you for this.
I’m 5′3,” and currently 144 lbs, and right around a 10/12 pant size (wide hips for the win!).
OH NOES! I am overweight! I must be 136, maximum, to be “normal.”
I’ve been that thin. I never dieted (I resolved while still in middle school that I would not subject myself to that), but I could afford a gym membership, which I enjoyed, and I was a solid size 8. I had no desire to be a 6, which I knew wouldn’t be healthy. 136 lbs is a limit for me, but it’s the lower limit, not the upper one. I don’t care what the arbitrary chart has to say about it.
Thank you so much for the visual confirmation that there are so MANY people who, like myself, do not and should not conform to these ridiculous and irrelevant standards.
On a personal level, it is such a relief and I am so glad to see such a great illustration of just how (un)helpful the BMI is. I have never been in the ‘normal’ weight range, but when I have dropped enough weight to be ‘overweight’ (still 5 kg over ‘normal’) I looked like a child whose bones had just experienced a big growth spurt but whose tissue mass had not caught up. I was all elbows and knees! It was enough for my mum to start telling me she was concerned that I might be losing too much weight!
However, the government is always going to insist on having a ’standardised test’ to gauge the extent of the ‘obesity epidemic’. It’s what governments do. How else are they going to fill all those tables in reports and set ‘targets’. What is needed is a better way of measuring levels of health in the population. But, how can that be done in a quantitative fashion? It’s a real challenge.
As for all the self-righteous anti-fat muppets who are always just a trifle too quick to judge… well, I wonder what’s lacking in their lives that they need to look down on other people to feel good about themselves?
[...] exists. On people even; on their (our) bodies. On the bodies of people you know and love. Looks are deceptive. And no-where is it written that you get the right to judge others as somehow less of a person [...]
But, how can that be done in a quantitative fashion?
Life span works pretty well! (The problem is that it shows things are always improving, not that we’re constantly in a state of crisis, so it hasn’t exactly caught on…)
I think its also interesting to note that even though I do not look overly fat, which i am, i have no shame in my game, my doctor told me that i am SUPER MORBIDLY OBESE. Now I am not very tall and weigh around 350lbs and I feel this statement is incorrect. My bmi was i do believe 60 or something. Either way, i feel its a crock!
I love this project. It is so validating to see how beautiful so-called “overweight” people, “obese” and even “morbidly obese” people, can be. I’ve thought, all along, that BMI made no sense (even assuming fatness was an important marker of health, which it apparently isn’t, BMI doesn’t take build, bone structure and muscle tone into account).
Here it was telling me that at my lightest adult weight – a weight reached after a severe crash diet that had me losing my hair – I was “overweight”, and at my typical weight, which I’m finally learning to accept and be happy with but which I never thought of as “DEATHFAT”, I am morbidly obese. I knew, intellectually, it was meaningless, but it was difficult not to question myself, to wonder if my body image was distorted. Not that being fatter than me would be a terrible thing, but the BMI seemed to be telling me I didn’t know how fat I actually was – and I think I do, thankyouverymuch.
Seeing the other women with the same numbers as me really helps me to realize that, regardless of BMI labels, I can possibly really look the way I think I look – and I’m ready to accept that, and throw this BMI bullshit out the window once and for all.
I noticed that, when other comments include height and weight, etc. I find myself slipping into comparison mode. In the back of my head a little voice is saying “she’s smaller than me and insecure, maybe I shouldn’t be so confident” or “she wears DDD (like I do) and considers that oversize, maybe I shouldn’t be happy with my body”.
It makes me think that saying a particular weight is “too fat” or “not *too* fat” or “too skinny” or any other value judgment is damaging – it reinforces this way of looking at our bodies – putting them into categories and trying to make them measure up to some arbitrary ideal. (I’m not saying DDD might not be too big for somebody else, but claiming it is objectively oversize would be a problem. It’s not oversize for me.) I think it’s easy to feel justified in attacking the body type glorified by the media – skinny, big boobs, etc., but that is a trap which reinforces the good body/bad body mentality we need to overcome.
Bodies shouldn’t be subject to such judgments – as the fat nutritionist (who is AWESOME) said “your body is your home”, and because of that, these kinds of external criteria don’t work. I’m beginning to think of my body as innately good, rather than as something to mold and control, and it is incredibly liberating.
Sorry for being so long-winded, and thanks again for doing this project!
That was jolly interesting. I was struck by how often a person labelled ‘overweight’ was what I’d consider normal, and a person labelled ‘obese’ was only what I’d call overweight. Not all the photos let you clearly see the size and shape of the person’s body, because of their pose or the lighting, but many of them are quite thought-provoking.
ditto to all the ‘awesome’ comments. it’s funny how the pattern that emerged to me was “boobs = obesity” (which plays out in my own body, too). no wonder we needed implants to reconcile our opposing desires of the female physique.
I think this project is fantastic.
I recently had to get a copy of my medical records from my school’s health clinic, and made the mistake of reading through them before I handed them over to my new doctor. More or less every sheet referred to me as a “Morbidly Obese Female” (or sometimes the even more offensive sounding “Grossly Obese Female”, I’m not gross!) regardless of what I had gone in for. As if that’s the only defining factor worth writing about me, or related to the ear infection I had last spring after swimming in a pool, or my tendency towards seasonal allergies.
Of course I understand there is some necessity for a standardized measurement of weight and height and my reaction to the terms used in my records was probably overly sensitive. I am unhealthy because of my weight. However, making me (or anyone else) feel dirty because of what they weigh is unnecessary and will likely only add to one’s problems.
All in all, it seems using the BMI Index is neglectful of medical professionals both because it is a hurtful and ineffectual way of ’summing up’ a person, and because it is a system so arbitrary that it cannot possibly predict a patient’s actual state of health.
I have a question for the community here — what is the solution? Is it to:
1) redefine normal, or
2) come up with less-offensive terms that don’t degrade those they are assigned to
I ask because the implications are very different. If you redefine normal, the mocking is simply shifted to those who are currently labeled “normal” or “underweight”. It seems nobody will ever be happy with terms that categorize them as abnormal.
-Josh
At the top, you said the slideshow is “to demonstrate just how ridiculous the BMI standards are”. That message did not come through for me. The only message I got is that if you take pictures of people in all different kinds of lighting, wearing all different kinds of clothes, in all different kinds of poses, in all kinds of environments, from all different kinds of angles, it’s pretty tough to draw any conclusions about anything.
I hope that doesn’t sound snarky. I just feel that if you showed this slideshow to a hundred random people WITHOUT telling them it had anything to do with health or BMI or FA, and you asked them what the purpose of the slideshow was, they wouldn’t come up with anything.
One other thought: do you object to the concept of BMI or the presentation? In other words, suppose that instead of “underweight”, “overweight”, etc. you had the following:
“Category 1 : you should ask your doctor if adding more calories to your diet would improve your overall health.”
“Category 2: studies indicate that, by most metrics, the healthiest people are in this category”
“Category 3: nothing to worry about, but you might ask your doctor to do some basic checks (cholesterol, BP, A1C) to see if changing some diet and exercise patterns would help”
And so forth. Basically what I’m asking is, are the words themselves (”overweight”, “obese”) too judgmental, or do you object to the whole BMI idea?
are you still looking for pictures?
I happen to be an example of the ‘underweight’ despite having rolls worth of fat. I just don’t have much muscle, and my bone structure is fairly delicate, so I don’t tip the scales.
When I was 14, before I got tall, my BMI was ‘overweight’. On that note, high schools should never, ever give their students a BMI. It’s barely justifiable for an adult, but kids who are still growing don’t fit into their system at all, and it tears developing self esteem to shreds.
Jessa, I’m not sure your weight determines how healthy, or unhealthy, you are :)
Thankyouthankyouthankyouthankyouthankyouthanyouthankyouthank you: For…everything. Inspiration, sanity, good journalism, and good humor!
I really needed to see this. I have lost a lot of weight (115 lbs) and still plan to lose about 40 more. However most people (basing it on looks) think that will get me to an unhealthy number but that was putting me on the higher end of the normal BMI. I am really working hard on accepting my body, but I know I am going to get to that number at least once, even if it is too low. But I am trying to focus more on my health than on the scale at the moment, as abhorrent as I find exercise.
This slide show really made me realize how skewed my body image is though. I can’t help but compare myself and the person I figured I looked most like was an inch and a half shorter and 45 pounds heavier. I don’t know, that just kind of came as a revelation that what I see in the mirror might just not be the truth. When I look at the pictures I think every single person in there is beautiful. It makes me think maybe I can try and think that about myself, regardless of what size/weight/BMI I am at. It is going to be a hard struggle but I hope I can get there.
[...] BMI? Bring it up if you want to – you’re bound to learn a thing or two. [...]
[...] screw you BMI, I AM NOT A NUMBER. http://kateharding.net/bmi-illustrated/ [...]
I had forgotten all about this — and gosh, I was such a fat ass. Look at me. Disgusting. Just a pathetic example of what it means to be a decent American woman.
I’m glad this is out there and getting fresh press. It was such a brilliant idea!
To Josh and k1023, the problem is not that the words are offensive to some people, it’s that the formula is *completely* wrong. Someone’s weight/height has nothing to do with their individual state of health.
I’m a naturally large-framed, large-breasted woman and, when I lost weight and got down to a BMI of 25, several people told me “Don’t lose any more weight, will you? You’re thin enough.” An asian woman can carry too much fat despite fitting into a healthy weight range. I have a friend who can almost bench-press her own bodyweight yet, because muscle weighs more than fat, is described as obese.
Measuring fat % and cardiovascular fitness may be a better measure of health.
In college a friend was in ROTC, and he didn’t match their weight/height charts. He didn’t have any fat on him, rock solid, but he was built square, ape arms, heavy large chest — so they told him to lose weight, but the more he worked out (and he made us go out and pace him on running, and try to encourage him to do more) the more muscle he put on, and the worse he looked on their stupid charts, eventually they had to admit he didn’t have any fat to give up.
Sometimes I wonder if the BMI is only right for some folks, and doesn’t take into account some body types. I am morbid obese, but I don’t wear that large a dress size, not unhealthy, or look that bad — I am tall for a woman, and very broad shoulders, and hip bones – does the BMI take into account body types?
hot DAMN I’m glad I saw this.. I’ve been curious about the accuracy of BMI and I am ecstatic to learn that it’s essentially bullshit. yeehaw. thank you very much for this.
Oddly enough, the same link that brought me to your wonderful slide show also linked to a BMI calculator and an ‘ideal weight’ calculator. Too bizarre! Thanks for an enlightening discussion of how the medical/diet industry tries to make us feel terrible about ourselves. Remember how one of the commercial diet plans started out by advertising how people (read, women) went from a size 22 to a ‘healthy’ size 12, and in a few years was bragging about how a size 8 had gotten down to a sexy size 2? I don’t mind so much that they keep raising the hoop we have to jump through, but I do wish they wouldn’t set it on fire first.
[...] 11. From KateHarding.net, a blog on the “fatosphere” called Shapely Prose that dispels fat stereotypes and catalogs the effects of pop-culture on women from a very funny, blunt and feminist perspective. Check out this articleon the lack of fat heroines in romance novels. Also, check on the BMI slide show here. [...]
This is great! You’re right about BMI being misleading.
[...] Fiquei sabendo desse BMI Project, que tem uma galeria de slides no blog da Kate Hardling, e outra no Flickr. BMI é Body Mass Index, o nosso Índice de Massa [...]
OH MY GOD!!!!! Thank you SO MUCH for this!!!!!!!! I have been fretting recently because even though I wear a size ten, don’t appear fat and to top it off work out 5 days a week and eat very well, I weigh about 185 and at 5′8 that makes me quite “overweight”. I was so worried that what I saw in the mirror was different from how I actually looked- I liked what I saw but what if I was deluding myself into thinking I looked like something else! This project is amazing and I have just discarded all of that! THANK YOU!!!!
Fabulous! My sister and I are the same height but while I have a “normal” BMI, she’s considered borderline obese because she plays college basketball and is RIPPED. Her body fat percentage is way lower than mine, but according to BMI, I’m the healthier one…even though we wear the same size clothes. Thanks for putting this into a format that people can see.