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	<title>Comments on: Fat Visibility in YA Fiction</title>
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		<title>By: EverythingBurns</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/12/07/fat-visibility-in-ya-fiction/#comment-129159</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[EverythingBurns]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Feb 2010 16:24:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=4019#comment-129159</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In Aliens Ate My Homework and the following books of the series by Bruce Coville, the main character is &quot;pudgy&quot; (and klutzy, mostly, I think, because he&#039;s teased, which makes it all worse).  He goes on an alien adventure and while he does get in better shape, it&#039;s never about his weight, it&#039;s about all the running and climbing and adventure for the mission, and the book - insofar as I can remember - never says anything about him getting skinny, just fitter.  Which makes him less clumsy, since he has self-confidence.  He still loves his mom&#039;s baked with love homemade cookies.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In Aliens Ate My Homework and the following books of the series by Bruce Coville, the main character is &#8220;pudgy&#8221; (and klutzy, mostly, I think, because he&#8217;s teased, which makes it all worse).  He goes on an alien adventure and while he does get in better shape, it&#8217;s never about his weight, it&#8217;s about all the running and climbing and adventure for the mission, and the book &#8211; insofar as I can remember &#8211; never says anything about him getting skinny, just fitter.  Which makes him less clumsy, since he has self-confidence.  He still loves his mom&#8217;s baked with love homemade cookies.</p>
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		<title>By: Shauna</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/12/07/fat-visibility-in-ya-fiction/#comment-126046</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Shauna]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jan 2010 05:23:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=4019#comment-126046</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Patriarchy Slayer, did you ever watch the movie &quot;Nines&quot;?

There is a character in that movie who is quite overweight but her weight is only brought up a handful of times.

Otherwise, she&#039;s humorous, energetic and multi-dimensional, and I enjoyed her acting quite a lot (especially her &quot;singing nun broadway musical&quot; part, lol!).

Even Ryan Reynold&#039;s character admits at the end that she was his &quot;favorite&quot; one, not because of her weight, but because of WHO SHE WAS.   But then again, this is a fairly non-mainstream movie, so if you have a chance, check it out.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Patriarchy Slayer, did you ever watch the movie &#8220;Nines&#8221;?</p>
<p>There is a character in that movie who is quite overweight but her weight is only brought up a handful of times.</p>
<p>Otherwise, she&#8217;s humorous, energetic and multi-dimensional, and I enjoyed her acting quite a lot (especially her &#8220;singing nun broadway musical&#8221; part, lol!).</p>
<p>Even Ryan Reynold&#8217;s character admits at the end that she was his &#8220;favorite&#8221; one, not because of her weight, but because of WHO SHE WAS.   But then again, this is a fairly non-mainstream movie, so if you have a chance, check it out.</p>
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		<title>By: Shauna</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/12/07/fat-visibility-in-ya-fiction/#comment-126045</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Shauna]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jan 2010 05:18:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=4019#comment-126045</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I haven&#039;t heard anyone mention &quot;Life in the Fat Lane&quot; yet ( info here: http://litmed.med.nyu.edu/Annotation?action=view&amp;annid=1500), but it profoundly affected me.

This book fucked me up, big time.  Especially since I already had tons of weight fluctuation and my mom is basically this tiny little thing (like she complains about being 110 pounds because she&#039;s &quot;so much fatter&quot; than she was when she was 100 pounds).  I&#039;m something like 218 pounds right now (and that&#039;s after a bunch of weight fluctuations and pregnancy and several metabolic disorders and such).

Basically the whole idea is that the main character is the hottest girl in school, homecoming queen, etc and then she starts gaining tons of weight for no apparent reason and it turns out it&#039;s a metabolic disorder that basically has no cure or treatment that works and it&#039;s all about how her entire life falls apart (including her family and her friends and school life).

Of course, let&#039;s not forget that once she&#039;s a &quot;huge fatty&quot; the only one who shows any interest in her is a similarly morbidly obese guy who is basically described as a disgusting slob that everyone also (get this) thinks is &quot;gay&quot; BECAUSE of his weight for some reason.

It just really traumatized me that fat was equated with either death or the death of anything enjoyable in your life.  And I journaled very heavily during my 8th grade through senior year of high school.  I remember writing an entry in which I literally wrote that I would rather put a gun to my head and pull the trigger than be fat.  This was mostly due to the fact that after reading that book (and dealing with the multiple traumatizing lectures and messages from my thin blond mom), I came to the conclusion that there was NO REASON TO LIVE if I became &quot;fat&quot; to any extent.  Because apparently, according to this book, the simple act of BEING FAT will not only invariably RUIN YOUR LIFE, but it will RUIN THE LIVES OF EVERYONE AROUND YOU WHO YOU CARE ABOUT.

WTF.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I haven&#8217;t heard anyone mention &#8220;Life in the Fat Lane&#8221; yet ( info here: <a href="http://litmed.med.nyu.edu/Annotation?action=view&#038;annid=1500" rel="nofollow">http://litmed.med.nyu.edu/Annotation?action=view&#038;annid=1500</a>), but it profoundly affected me.</p>
<p>This book fucked me up, big time.  Especially since I already had tons of weight fluctuation and my mom is basically this tiny little thing (like she complains about being 110 pounds because she&#8217;s &#8220;so much fatter&#8221; than she was when she was 100 pounds).  I&#8217;m something like 218 pounds right now (and that&#8217;s after a bunch of weight fluctuations and pregnancy and several metabolic disorders and such).</p>
<p>Basically the whole idea is that the main character is the hottest girl in school, homecoming queen, etc and then she starts gaining tons of weight for no apparent reason and it turns out it&#8217;s a metabolic disorder that basically has no cure or treatment that works and it&#8217;s all about how her entire life falls apart (including her family and her friends and school life).</p>
<p>Of course, let&#8217;s not forget that once she&#8217;s a &#8220;huge fatty&#8221; the only one who shows any interest in her is a similarly morbidly obese guy who is basically described as a disgusting slob that everyone also (get this) thinks is &#8220;gay&#8221; BECAUSE of his weight for some reason.</p>
<p>It just really traumatized me that fat was equated with either death or the death of anything enjoyable in your life.  And I journaled very heavily during my 8th grade through senior year of high school.  I remember writing an entry in which I literally wrote that I would rather put a gun to my head and pull the trigger than be fat.  This was mostly due to the fact that after reading that book (and dealing with the multiple traumatizing lectures and messages from my thin blond mom), I came to the conclusion that there was NO REASON TO LIVE if I became &#8220;fat&#8221; to any extent.  Because apparently, according to this book, the simple act of BEING FAT will not only invariably RUIN YOUR LIFE, but it will RUIN THE LIVES OF EVERYONE AROUND YOU WHO YOU CARE ABOUT.</p>
<p>WTF.</p>
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		<title>By: Piffle</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/12/07/fat-visibility-in-ya-fiction/#comment-125369</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Piffle]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 30 Dec 2009 04:45:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=4019#comment-125369</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Someone above asked for a FA book for a four year old, and I found a wonderful book for one of my nephews this Christmas.  It&#039;s called &quot;Mama, Do You Love Me?&quot; It&#039;s a simple Q&amp;A between Mom and kid about would you love me if?  The Mom is very fat, but you can only tell from the pictures.  No comment at all is made about her fatness.  Pretty pictures too.

I heartily second the Tamora Pierce books.  I don&#039;t remember which book it was; (Possible spoiler!) but in one of them the kid has to cure a plague killing lots of people.  Turns out the genesis of the plague is someone trying to get thin quick via magic, which goes horribly wrong.  I avidly buy all her newest books.  I am so waiting for the newest Beka Cooper!

Also, the books that introduced me to the possibility of heroines being competent and full of character were Andre Norton&#039;s Witch World books.  I don&#039;t remember what her stance on fat was, but her women and girls were pluck to the backbone.  They had adventures and real moral dilemmas to consider.

I&#039;m over forty, and I adore many YA authors.  Wrede, Tamora Pierce, Jane Yolen, Pamela Dean, Robin McKinley and others.

Personally, I have a catagory of books I call good fluff.  There are many writers I put in this catagory, and I don&#039;t think it&#039;s derogatory.  Writing is telling a story and telling it well; a book doesn&#039;t need to be a complicated metaphor to be a good book.  And the books I find least readable are the ones who try to be literary without a good story as a vehicle.  I&#039;ll take cardboard characters and obvious plots over those any day.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Someone above asked for a FA book for a four year old, and I found a wonderful book for one of my nephews this Christmas.  It&#8217;s called &#8220;Mama, Do You Love Me?&#8221; It&#8217;s a simple Q&amp;A between Mom and kid about would you love me if?  The Mom is very fat, but you can only tell from the pictures.  No comment at all is made about her fatness.  Pretty pictures too.</p>
<p>I heartily second the Tamora Pierce books.  I don&#8217;t remember which book it was; (Possible spoiler!) but in one of them the kid has to cure a plague killing lots of people.  Turns out the genesis of the plague is someone trying to get thin quick via magic, which goes horribly wrong.  I avidly buy all her newest books.  I am so waiting for the newest Beka Cooper!</p>
<p>Also, the books that introduced me to the possibility of heroines being competent and full of character were Andre Norton&#8217;s Witch World books.  I don&#8217;t remember what her stance on fat was, but her women and girls were pluck to the backbone.  They had adventures and real moral dilemmas to consider.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m over forty, and I adore many YA authors.  Wrede, Tamora Pierce, Jane Yolen, Pamela Dean, Robin McKinley and others.</p>
<p>Personally, I have a catagory of books I call good fluff.  There are many writers I put in this catagory, and I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s derogatory.  Writing is telling a story and telling it well; a book doesn&#8217;t need to be a complicated metaphor to be a good book.  And the books I find least readable are the ones who try to be literary without a good story as a vehicle.  I&#8217;ll take cardboard characters and obvious plots over those any day.</p>
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		<title>By: DW</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/12/07/fat-visibility-in-ya-fiction/#comment-124666</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[DW]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Dec 2009 17:01:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=4019#comment-124666</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[@LilahMorgan, glad you mentioned Pierce and Jones, too of my faves. I think the Chrestomanci Chronicles too are good in that area--his wife is plump and powerful. Her frumpiness is also mentioned in passing as quite the opposite of Chrestomanci&#039;s laser focus on his clothes...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@LilahMorgan, glad you mentioned Pierce and Jones, too of my faves. I think the Chrestomanci Chronicles too are good in that area&#8211;his wife is plump and powerful. Her frumpiness is also mentioned in passing as quite the opposite of Chrestomanci&#8217;s laser focus on his clothes&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: PatriarchySlayer</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/12/07/fat-visibility-in-ya-fiction/#comment-124649</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[PatriarchySlayer]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Dec 2009 04:56:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=4019#comment-124649</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I would really like to see more diversity in films, tv and books. It&#039;s great to have a discussion about fat and fat acceptance. But why is it that every protagonist that isn&#039;t a size 2 is analyzed to death? Can you think of one protagonist who isn&#039;t &quot;average&quot; but is treated like other tv shows/movies/books. I can&#039;t. Being different is automatically the premise of the show. That gets tiresome. 
I just want to watch someone who looks more like me in a great program or an awesome book that isn&#039;t centered around their fat. 
But good for writers trying to present this issue in a better light.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would really like to see more diversity in films, tv and books. It&#8217;s great to have a discussion about fat and fat acceptance. But why is it that every protagonist that isn&#8217;t a size 2 is analyzed to death? Can you think of one protagonist who isn&#8217;t &#8220;average&#8221; but is treated like other tv shows/movies/books. I can&#8217;t. Being different is automatically the premise of the show. That gets tiresome.<br />
I just want to watch someone who looks more like me in a great program or an awesome book that isn&#8217;t centered around their fat.<br />
But good for writers trying to present this issue in a better light.</p>
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		<title>By: Wednesday</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/12/07/fat-visibility-in-ya-fiction/#comment-124634</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Wednesday]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Dec 2009 00:14:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=4019#comment-124634</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I actually found &lt;em&gt;Princess Ben&lt;/em&gt; to be really problematic - I&#039;m a little surprised to see people reporting it so positively. The book was pretty explicit that she was fat because she was spoiled, lazy, had no self-control, and regularly gorged herself on things like lard. (No, I&#039;m not making that last one up.)  Then she is forced to eat meager rations and do hard labor (exercise),  and in the meanwhile learns Self Control, and then loses weight.

I don&#039;t think teens need to hear &quot;you wouldn&#039;t be so fat if only you had more self control&quot; yet again. They get it enough everywhere else. :/]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I actually found <em>Princess Ben</em> to be really problematic &#8211; I&#8217;m a little surprised to see people reporting it so positively. The book was pretty explicit that she was fat because she was spoiled, lazy, had no self-control, and regularly gorged herself on things like lard. (No, I&#8217;m not making that last one up.)  Then she is forced to eat meager rations and do hard labor (exercise),  and in the meanwhile learns Self Control, and then loses weight.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t think teens need to hear &#8220;you wouldn&#8217;t be so fat if only you had more self control&#8221; yet again. They get it enough everywhere else. :/</p>
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		<title>By: scrappy1</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/12/07/fat-visibility-in-ya-fiction/#comment-124633</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[scrappy1]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 21 Dec 2009 00:11:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=4019#comment-124633</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;m surprised that no one has mentioned &quot;Nobody&#039;s Family is Going to Change.&quot;  I haven&#039;t read it since I was maybe 12.  The protagonist, an African-American young woman, is fat.  She feels a sense of self-loathing that is almost palpable -- connected not just with her weight, but with getting her period and just generally being a corporeal entity with this embarrassing BODY.  I wasn&#039;t fat, but I still remember relating to it, uncomfortably, because it was so painful to just be a person at that age.  Anyway, the moral of the story is ultimately about self-acceptance, about not buying into one&#039;s family&#039;s -- and by extension, society&#039;s -- notion of what constitutes success or beauty or popularity.

Anyone who&#039;s read it more recently who can comment?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m surprised that no one has mentioned &#8220;Nobody&#8217;s Family is Going to Change.&#8221;  I haven&#8217;t read it since I was maybe 12.  The protagonist, an African-American young woman, is fat.  She feels a sense of self-loathing that is almost palpable &#8212; connected not just with her weight, but with getting her period and just generally being a corporeal entity with this embarrassing BODY.  I wasn&#8217;t fat, but I still remember relating to it, uncomfortably, because it was so painful to just be a person at that age.  Anyway, the moral of the story is ultimately about self-acceptance, about not buying into one&#8217;s family&#8217;s &#8212; and by extension, society&#8217;s &#8212; notion of what constitutes success or beauty or popularity.</p>
<p>Anyone who&#8217;s read it more recently who can comment?</p>
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		<title>By: Mary</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/12/07/fat-visibility-in-ya-fiction/#comment-124632</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mary]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Dec 2009 23:53:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=4019#comment-124632</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[While I agree Blubber isn&#039;t fat positive, it (much like the someone similarly plotted Nothing&#039;s Fair in Fifth Grade) it does say a lot about kids who are even slightly different being unfairly targeted and tortured in a systematic way.  Now when we read these books we notice how crappy the fat characters are, but they are still valuable because they present children as complex and manipulative and engaging in power struggles instead of mischievous scamps. As a kid who often felt fat, I was struck by how realistic the situations were, as I&#039;m sure most kids can relate to the kind of emotional torture they inflict for no reason.

Fat Chance was pretty messed up. What disturbed me about it was also that the protagonist keeps mentioning her totally average height and weight or something and the message is that maybe she will be &quot;thin again&quot; at some point. I&#039;m sure it gave many people a complex.

There&#039;s a Bat in Bunk Five annoyed me too. It definitely suffered from the syndrome that plagues many YA books- everything gets wrapped up really fast at the end. Though I do think it&#039;s significant how she still doesn&#039;t like or trust her body after she loses weight.

I wish I had The Earth, My Butt, and Other Round Things as a kid because it is so genuinely, flat-out empowering, but books like The Cat Ate My Gymsuit were helpful to me because they were relatable in ways tons of YA fiction definitely was not. And in some ways it&#039;s not always realistic to have a happy ending where the fat girl learns she can kick ass at the end. I think a lot of those books had that classic 70&#039;s pessimistic tone, where the ending is neither here nor there.

Oh man, I too never forgot the immortal line about looking like a &quot;thin Dolly Parton.&quot; Like that makes any sense.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>While I agree Blubber isn&#8217;t fat positive, it (much like the someone similarly plotted Nothing&#8217;s Fair in Fifth Grade) it does say a lot about kids who are even slightly different being unfairly targeted and tortured in a systematic way.  Now when we read these books we notice how crappy the fat characters are, but they are still valuable because they present children as complex and manipulative and engaging in power struggles instead of mischievous scamps. As a kid who often felt fat, I was struck by how realistic the situations were, as I&#8217;m sure most kids can relate to the kind of emotional torture they inflict for no reason.</p>
<p>Fat Chance was pretty messed up. What disturbed me about it was also that the protagonist keeps mentioning her totally average height and weight or something and the message is that maybe she will be &#8220;thin again&#8221; at some point. I&#8217;m sure it gave many people a complex.</p>
<p>There&#8217;s a Bat in Bunk Five annoyed me too. It definitely suffered from the syndrome that plagues many YA books- everything gets wrapped up really fast at the end. Though I do think it&#8217;s significant how she still doesn&#8217;t like or trust her body after she loses weight.</p>
<p>I wish I had The Earth, My Butt, and Other Round Things as a kid because it is so genuinely, flat-out empowering, but books like The Cat Ate My Gymsuit were helpful to me because they were relatable in ways tons of YA fiction definitely was not. And in some ways it&#8217;s not always realistic to have a happy ending where the fat girl learns she can kick ass at the end. I think a lot of those books had that classic 70&#8242;s pessimistic tone, where the ending is neither here nor there.</p>
<p>Oh man, I too never forgot the immortal line about looking like a &#8220;thin Dolly Parton.&#8221; Like that makes any sense.</p>
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		<title>By: JupiterPluvius</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/12/07/fat-visibility-in-ya-fiction/#comment-124110</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[JupiterPluvius]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Dec 2009 06:17:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=4019#comment-124110</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[And to my fellow hyperlexics: the question was not actually &quot;what did you read when you were young?&quot; but &quot;what YA fiction presents fatness in interesting ways?&quot;  Answering that question with discussions of adult fiction you read when you were a child is irrelevant at best.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And to my fellow hyperlexics: the question was not actually &#8220;what did you read when you were young?&#8221; but &#8220;what YA fiction presents fatness in interesting ways?&#8221;  Answering that question with discussions of adult fiction you read when you were a child is irrelevant at best.</p>
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