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	<title>Comments on: Fatty TV: OMGWTFBBW!</title>
	<atom:link href="http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/</link>
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		<title>By: Lori</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/#comment-105226</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lori]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Jul 2009 14:40:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=3412#comment-105226</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have to admit, DDD has totally charmed me.  I&#039;m a sucker for Lifetime, so that&#039;s probably much of it, but I do think it has a lot of potential.  There have been some really silly and problematic things--the spray can of cheese, obviously, and Jane not being able to get out of a not-too-deep squat (which I honestly can&#039;t imagine would be a problem for someone her size absent an issue with her knees or back)--but overall it&#039;s quite positive.  I thought, from all the talk of donuts, that we&#039;d be seeing Jane continually overeat, but honestly I don&#039;t think they&#039;ve shown her overeating at all, just eating and enjoying it.  It&#039;s hard to see her preference for a sandwich at lunchtime over a grilled chicken breast and celery sticks as a sign of a problem with overeating.  Even the one donut she eats when she gets to work seems relatively unproblematic, since it&#039;s her breakfast.  The spray cheese comfort eating in the first episode was ridiculous, but hopefully that will be the end of that.  In general I do think they&#039;re protraying her more as somebody who doesn&#039;t count calories than as somebody who overeats.

And, while the idea that fat people don&#039;t exercise (which has come up with both Jane and the woman she defended) is just flat-out wrong, at least the implication is that Jane doesn&#039;t exercise because she&#039;s too busy, not because she&#039;s too lazy.  

Plus, I think my main positive feelings about the show just come from Jane being so darn adorable that it&#039;s hard not to think she&#039;s both likeable and beautiful.  She is portrayed so positively in terms of her intelligence and personality and altruism that I think it would be hard for a viewer to come away from the show thinking really bad things about fat people, even if a few stereotypes are there.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to admit, DDD has totally charmed me.  I&#8217;m a sucker for Lifetime, so that&#8217;s probably much of it, but I do think it has a lot of potential.  There have been some really silly and problematic things&#8211;the spray can of cheese, obviously, and Jane not being able to get out of a not-too-deep squat (which I honestly can&#8217;t imagine would be a problem for someone her size absent an issue with her knees or back)&#8211;but overall it&#8217;s quite positive.  I thought, from all the talk of donuts, that we&#8217;d be seeing Jane continually overeat, but honestly I don&#8217;t think they&#8217;ve shown her overeating at all, just eating and enjoying it.  It&#8217;s hard to see her preference for a sandwich at lunchtime over a grilled chicken breast and celery sticks as a sign of a problem with overeating.  Even the one donut she eats when she gets to work seems relatively unproblematic, since it&#8217;s her breakfast.  The spray cheese comfort eating in the first episode was ridiculous, but hopefully that will be the end of that.  In general I do think they&#8217;re protraying her more as somebody who doesn&#8217;t count calories than as somebody who overeats.</p>
<p>And, while the idea that fat people don&#8217;t exercise (which has come up with both Jane and the woman she defended) is just flat-out wrong, at least the implication is that Jane doesn&#8217;t exercise because she&#8217;s too busy, not because she&#8217;s too lazy.  </p>
<p>Plus, I think my main positive feelings about the show just come from Jane being so darn adorable that it&#8217;s hard not to think she&#8217;s both likeable and beautiful.  She is portrayed so positively in terms of her intelligence and personality and altruism that I think it would be hard for a viewer to come away from the show thinking really bad things about fat people, even if a few stereotypes are there.</p>
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		<title>By: scattered marbles</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/#comment-105196</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[scattered marbles]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Jul 2009 06:00:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=3412#comment-105196</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[DRST you said it so very very well thank you]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DRST you said it so very very well thank you</p>
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		<title>By: Starling</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/#comment-105188</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Starling]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 31 Jul 2009 04:25:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=3412#comment-105188</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Okay, late to the party and mostly off-topic, but I just read Kate&#039;s Salon piece and was struck by her comments re the bachelor.  How often do we fat ladies actually hear men say, &quot;Dear God, you are the sexiest thing ever--just my type&quot;?  It&#039;s awesome to hear a guy say it on TV, but OMG, it is the best thing ever to hear from a guy you&#039;re on a first date with.  I think I&#039;m pretty good about loving my body, size irrelevant, but I&#039;ve realized how I have a bit of a chip on my shoulder about it.  Like it&#039;s a really ugly baby or something.  I&#039;m always a little on the defensive. 

So a nice smart guy who really just plain likes every damned inch of me (and every pound) was a joy to find.  We&#039;re not still dating, but it kind of broke through the complete bullshit that fat girls are second-tier choices for men.  We aren&#039;t.  And it&#039;s done miraculous things for my love life, because I&#039;m much more comfortable expecting men to find me devastatingly sexy, instead of just hoping like hell I&#039;ll be acceptable.  It&#039;s weird how well it works.  Or maybe it just scares away the ones who would prefer to nag me about my &quot;health.&quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay, late to the party and mostly off-topic, but I just read Kate&#8217;s Salon piece and was struck by her comments re the bachelor.  How often do we fat ladies actually hear men say, &#8220;Dear God, you are the sexiest thing ever&#8211;just my type&#8221;?  It&#8217;s awesome to hear a guy say it on TV, but OMG, it is the best thing ever to hear from a guy you&#8217;re on a first date with.  I think I&#8217;m pretty good about loving my body, size irrelevant, but I&#8217;ve realized how I have a bit of a chip on my shoulder about it.  Like it&#8217;s a really ugly baby or something.  I&#8217;m always a little on the defensive. </p>
<p>So a nice smart guy who really just plain likes every damned inch of me (and every pound) was a joy to find.  We&#8217;re not still dating, but it kind of broke through the complete bullshit that fat girls are second-tier choices for men.  We aren&#8217;t.  And it&#8217;s done miraculous things for my love life, because I&#8217;m much more comfortable expecting men to find me devastatingly sexy, instead of just hoping like hell I&#8217;ll be acceptable.  It&#8217;s weird how well it works.  Or maybe it just scares away the ones who would prefer to nag me about my &#8220;health.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Yeahsurewhatever</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/#comment-104978</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Yeahsurewhatever]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 23:46:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=3412#comment-104978</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I wonder, would DDD have been more interesting if instead of killing the original Jane, she had found herself in Deb&#039;s body? It would have been more in line with the traditional Freaky Friday story structure, and would have totally negated the whole weird &quot;Deb gets to take everything that Jane worked really really hard for&quot; angle.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wonder, would DDD have been more interesting if instead of killing the original Jane, she had found herself in Deb&#8217;s body? It would have been more in line with the traditional Freaky Friday story structure, and would have totally negated the whole weird &#8220;Deb gets to take everything that Jane worked really really hard for&#8221; angle.</p>
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		<title>By: Cassi</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/#comment-104977</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cassi]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 23:45:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=3412#comment-104977</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[DRST, that&#039;s absolutely brill.  In fact, they&#039;ve already taken a step with the Stacy character, having her move one tiny iota away from a vacuous model and done the same with the &quot;evil&quot; Kim character (having her show some actual emotion).  Perhaps all the polemics are largely plot devices rather than a reflection of the writers intentions.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>DRST, that&#8217;s absolutely brill.  In fact, they&#8217;ve already taken a step with the Stacy character, having her move one tiny iota away from a vacuous model and done the same with the &#8220;evil&#8221; Kim character (having her show some actual emotion).  Perhaps all the polemics are largely plot devices rather than a reflection of the writers intentions.</p>
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		<title>By: ElleDee</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/#comment-104962</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[ElleDee]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 21:19:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=3412#comment-104962</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I know I&#039;m late on this, but I feel compelled to point out that the women who were kicked off of MTL were 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 6th (tied) heaviest women on the show. This doesn&#039;t account for differences in height and proportions, but still. (Also there&#039;s only 2 women in their thirties left and the ages of the dismissed women were 34, 32, 30, 28 and 25. Hmmm...)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I know I&#8217;m late on this, but I feel compelled to point out that the women who were kicked off of MTL were 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 6th (tied) heaviest women on the show. This doesn&#8217;t account for differences in height and proportions, but still. (Also there&#8217;s only 2 women in their thirties left and the ages of the dismissed women were 34, 32, 30, 28 and 25. Hmmm&#8230;)</p>
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		<title>By: SugarLeigh</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/#comment-104956</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[SugarLeigh]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 20:28:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=3412#comment-104956</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Okee dokee, wrote that Travel Channel piece, and if anybody wants to see it (it is long and rather mindvomit-esque) it can be found here:
http://sugar-for-sugar.livejournal.com/57077.html]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okee dokee, wrote that Travel Channel piece, and if anybody wants to see it (it is long and rather mindvomit-esque) it can be found here:<br />
<a href="http://sugar-for-sugar.livejournal.com/57077.html" rel="nofollow">http://sugar-for-sugar.livejournal.com/57077.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Godless Heathen</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/#comment-104941</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Godless Heathen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 17:22:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=3412#comment-104941</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Oh bugger it! I went to the Lifetime website to finally get to watch it and there are no closed captions.  I guess that means I wait until it come out on DVD and my library gets a copy of season 1.  Accessibility fail Lifetime, no ad views for you.

I&#039;m sure if I write to them to complain I&#039;ll get a whiny letter back about how &lt;i&gt;hard&lt;/i&gt; it is to put captions into flash videos...despite the fact that almost every major video content provider can do it now.  And also they&#039;d be whining to someone who makes &lt;b&gt;terrabytes&lt;/b&gt; of dvd rips with external caption files every month.  I&#039;m sure I&#039;ll buy it when they pee on my leg and tell me it&#039;s raining.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh bugger it! I went to the Lifetime website to finally get to watch it and there are no closed captions.  I guess that means I wait until it come out on DVD and my library gets a copy of season 1.  Accessibility fail Lifetime, no ad views for you.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure if I write to them to complain I&#8217;ll get a whiny letter back about how <i>hard</i> it is to put captions into flash videos&#8230;despite the fact that almost every major video content provider can do it now.  And also they&#8217;d be whining to someone who makes <b>terrabytes</b> of dvd rips with external caption files every month.  I&#8217;m sure I&#8217;ll buy it when they pee on my leg and tell me it&#8217;s raining.</p>
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		<title>By: Mary :: A Merry Life</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/#comment-104928</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mary :: A Merry Life]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 16:04:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=3412#comment-104928</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I actually have not seen Drop Dead Diva, but I&#039;m glad to hear that it has more positive vibes than More To Love did.  

I was honestly surprised by how stereotypical the women on More To Love appeared.  But I think that maybe you are right that fat people will have to go through a period of just being on TV before they are represented positively on TV.  In a way its like how other minority segments of the population made their way into the television culture.  Mocking stereotypes first, positive portrayals later, even though there have already been great examples of fat women in leading roles. Fat acceptance is something that will take time.  

I hated that they placed the women&#039;s weight next to their name and age.  They shouldn&#039;t be ashamed of that, because they were all really beautiful women, but why was that necessary?  It would never, ever happen on any of the other dating shows.  It was like the producers just couldn&#039;t get enough of saying &quot;Hey they are fat!  Look! Fat! See?&quot;  That bothered me.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I actually have not seen Drop Dead Diva, but I&#8217;m glad to hear that it has more positive vibes than More To Love did.  </p>
<p>I was honestly surprised by how stereotypical the women on More To Love appeared.  But I think that maybe you are right that fat people will have to go through a period of just being on TV before they are represented positively on TV.  In a way its like how other minority segments of the population made their way into the television culture.  Mocking stereotypes first, positive portrayals later, even though there have already been great examples of fat women in leading roles. Fat acceptance is something that will take time.  </p>
<p>I hated that they placed the women&#8217;s weight next to their name and age.  They shouldn&#8217;t be ashamed of that, because they were all really beautiful women, but why was that necessary?  It would never, ever happen on any of the other dating shows.  It was like the producers just couldn&#8217;t get enough of saying &#8220;Hey they are fat!  Look! Fat! See?&#8221;  That bothered me.</p>
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		<title>By: Lori</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2009/07/28/fatty-tv/#comment-104924</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Lori]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:40:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.net/?p=3412#comment-104924</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think maybe it would be less upsetting to see a fat character who loves food or eats a lot or comfort eats if TV shows also had thin characters who did that.  I mean, honestly, if 30 Rock were to bring on a fat character who really loved food, it wouldn&#039;t particularly bother me, because the show has always portrayed Tina Fey&#039;s thin character as being somebody who loves food.  But, when the only characters on a TV show who enjoy eating and don&#039;t eat only salads and grilled chicken breast are fat characters, it just reinforces the idea that the reason fat people are fat is because they like to eat.  

I&#039;ve got no problem with shows portraying people enjoying food.  Most people I know, fat and thin, enjoy food.  But, so much of TV presents enjoying food as totally strange and forbidden, and when enjoying food is restricted to fat characters, then it just leads to the conclusion that overeating=being fat.

I know I&#039;ve seen episodes of TV shows where a thin character has a break-up and eats ice cream.  There&#039;s not an indication, usually, that the behavior is disordered or unhealthy or problematic.  But, when a fat character eats a snack after a hard day, I do think the audience is supposed to have this &quot;Aha!  That&#039;s why they&#039;re &lt;b&gt;fat&lt;/b&gt;!&quot; reaction.  I can understand when somebody like Camryn Manheim would be so adamant about her character not eating donuts or having snacks on her desk, because while eating donuts and having snacks on the desk is something that both thin and fat people do, it&#039;s interpreted in a very, very different way when a fat person does it, and I do tend to think that until we move beyond the idea that fat people are fat because they eat too much, any representation of a fat person eating more than a thin person is going to unfortunately be problematic.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think maybe it would be less upsetting to see a fat character who loves food or eats a lot or comfort eats if TV shows also had thin characters who did that.  I mean, honestly, if 30 Rock were to bring on a fat character who really loved food, it wouldn&#8217;t particularly bother me, because the show has always portrayed Tina Fey&#8217;s thin character as being somebody who loves food.  But, when the only characters on a TV show who enjoy eating and don&#8217;t eat only salads and grilled chicken breast are fat characters, it just reinforces the idea that the reason fat people are fat is because they like to eat.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve got no problem with shows portraying people enjoying food.  Most people I know, fat and thin, enjoy food.  But, so much of TV presents enjoying food as totally strange and forbidden, and when enjoying food is restricted to fat characters, then it just leads to the conclusion that overeating=being fat.</p>
<p>I know I&#8217;ve seen episodes of TV shows where a thin character has a break-up and eats ice cream.  There&#8217;s not an indication, usually, that the behavior is disordered or unhealthy or problematic.  But, when a fat character eats a snack after a hard day, I do think the audience is supposed to have this &#8220;Aha!  That&#8217;s why they&#8217;re <b>fat</b>!&#8221; reaction.  I can understand when somebody like Camryn Manheim would be so adamant about her character not eating donuts or having snacks on her desk, because while eating donuts and having snacks on the desk is something that both thin and fat people do, it&#8217;s interpreted in a very, very different way when a fat person does it, and I do tend to think that until we move beyond the idea that fat people are fat because they eat too much, any representation of a fat person eating more than a thin person is going to unfortunately be problematic.</p>
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