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	<title>Comments on: Bring in the noise, bring in the fat</title>
	<atom:link href="http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/</link>
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		<title>By: Kate</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/#comment-55602</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kate]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 May 2008 06:57:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.wordpress.com/?p=1419#comment-55602</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[What perfect timing for your post---this weekend was Tribal Fest, and it was the first time I had gone, although I&#039;ve been taking both Tribal and Cabaret bellydance classes for a few years.  I&#039;ve always shied away from performing because of the belly-baring aspect.  It seems that no matter how much I find everyone else&#039;s body to be beautiful the way it is, I always think my fat&#039;s spread out unattractively or that moves just don&#039;t look good on my body.  Tribal Fest was a great chance to see all sorts of bodies onstage dancing, and it was a real encouragement to me to suck it up and bare it all. 

If anyone is interested in seeing a beautiful, large cabaret dancer, I suggest searching for Magidah, a Portland-based dancer.  She is one of the most amazing bellydancers I have ever seen, and she&#039;s just come out with a new line of dance clothing called MagidahWear (for &quot;the booty magnificent!&quot;)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What perfect timing for your post&#8212;this weekend was Tribal Fest, and it was the first time I had gone, although I&#8217;ve been taking both Tribal and Cabaret bellydance classes for a few years.  I&#8217;ve always shied away from performing because of the belly-baring aspect.  It seems that no matter how much I find everyone else&#8217;s body to be beautiful the way it is, I always think my fat&#8217;s spread out unattractively or that moves just don&#8217;t look good on my body.  Tribal Fest was a great chance to see all sorts of bodies onstage dancing, and it was a real encouragement to me to suck it up and bare it all. </p>
<p>If anyone is interested in seeing a beautiful, large cabaret dancer, I suggest searching for Magidah, a Portland-based dancer.  She is one of the most amazing bellydancers I have ever seen, and she&#8217;s just come out with a new line of dance clothing called MagidahWear (for &#8220;the booty magnificent!&#8221;)</p>
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		<title>By: fillyjonk</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/#comment-55389</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[fillyjonk]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 May 2008 20:38:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.wordpress.com/?p=1419#comment-55389</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Well, it certainly shouldn&#039;t keep you from &lt;i&gt;taking&lt;/i&gt; belly dance!  As I said somewhere above, in most classes you don&#039;t even have to show your belly if you don&#039;t want to... and anyway your classes will be full of sweaty people who probably didn&#039;t shave their armpits and definitely don&#039;t care about your body hair.  Class is not about looking pretty.

As for performance... cabaret style would probably prefer you to get waxed, but tribal is unlikely to care (ATS is full of girls with tattoos and dyed hair, and is definitely unconcerned with bodily idiosyncrasies).  And if it&#039;s a student performance or a for-fun performance and not a professional one, it&#039;s not as though anyone could &lt;i&gt;require&lt;/i&gt; you to do anything.  I can&#039;t see any reason why it would matter, anyway.  I guess it could potentially be distracting, but no more so than a birthmark, and I&#039;d hope that if you had a birthmark you wouldn&#039;t be worried that it would keep you from dancing.

Another option if you&#039;re self-conscious is just to wear your skirt or pants at belly-button level!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, it certainly shouldn&#8217;t keep you from <i>taking</i> belly dance!  As I said somewhere above, in most classes you don&#8217;t even have to show your belly if you don&#8217;t want to&#8230; and anyway your classes will be full of sweaty people who probably didn&#8217;t shave their armpits and definitely don&#8217;t care about your body hair.  Class is not about looking pretty.</p>
<p>As for performance&#8230; cabaret style would probably prefer you to get waxed, but tribal is unlikely to care (ATS is full of girls with tattoos and dyed hair, and is definitely unconcerned with bodily idiosyncrasies).  And if it&#8217;s a student performance or a for-fun performance and not a professional one, it&#8217;s not as though anyone could <i>require</i> you to do anything.  I can&#8217;t see any reason why it would matter, anyway.  I guess it could potentially be distracting, but no more so than a birthmark, and I&#8217;d hope that if you had a birthmark you wouldn&#8217;t be worried that it would keep you from dancing.</p>
<p>Another option if you&#8217;re self-conscious is just to wear your skirt or pants at belly-button level!</p>
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		<title>By: veganwobbly</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/#comment-55387</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[veganwobbly]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 May 2008 19:53:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.wordpress.com/?p=1419#comment-55387</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[not to completely hijack the conversation, but i&#039;ve wanted to take belly dancing for a while, cos my tummy&#039;s cute and round and i like dancing...but my happy trail rivals male-bodied individuals.  i&#039;ve grown to like it, but it&#039;s stopped me from wearing bikinis.  part of me seriously doesn&#039;t give a fuck, but part of me wonders if it&#039;ll be an issue.  i don&#039;t know y&#039;all, thoughts?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>not to completely hijack the conversation, but i&#8217;ve wanted to take belly dancing for a while, cos my tummy&#8217;s cute and round and i like dancing&#8230;but my happy trail rivals male-bodied individuals.  i&#8217;ve grown to like it, but it&#8217;s stopped me from wearing bikinis.  part of me seriously doesn&#8217;t give a fuck, but part of me wonders if it&#8217;ll be an issue.  i don&#8217;t know y&#8217;all, thoughts?</p>
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		<title>By: judgesnineteen</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/#comment-55345</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[judgesnineteen]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 May 2008 11:02:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.wordpress.com/?p=1419#comment-55345</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I took ballet for years.  One of the best dancers at my studio was also fat.  She was graceful, dammit!  And strong, and had beautiful technique.  It&#039;s not just my opinion, either, this is recognized as fact at that studio.  Of course she was always trying to lose weight, but it still taught us all something, to see a woman considerably heavier than any professional ballerina be so good at ballet.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I took ballet for years.  One of the best dancers at my studio was also fat.  She was graceful, dammit!  And strong, and had beautiful technique.  It&#8217;s not just my opinion, either, this is recognized as fact at that studio.  Of course she was always trying to lose weight, but it still taught us all something, to see a woman considerably heavier than any professional ballerina be so good at ballet.</p>
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		<title>By: elusis</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/#comment-55343</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[elusis]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 May 2008 09:20:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.wordpress.com/?p=1419#comment-55343</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Whoever was looking for classes in Seattle - Sharon Moore of Mandala Tribal!
http://www.mandalatribal.com/classes

She also teaches with inFusion Tribal:
http://www.infusiontribal.com/welcome


There&#039;s also Skin Deep Studios:
http://atsbellydance.com/2.html]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Whoever was looking for classes in Seattle &#8211; Sharon Moore of Mandala Tribal!<br />
<a href="http://www.mandalatribal.com/classes" rel="nofollow">http://www.mandalatribal.com/classes</a></p>
<p>She also teaches with inFusion Tribal:<br />
<a href="http://www.infusiontribal.com/welcome" rel="nofollow">http://www.infusiontribal.com/welcome</a></p>
<p>There&#8217;s also Skin Deep Studios:<br />
<a href="http://atsbellydance.com/2.html" rel="nofollow">http://atsbellydance.com/2.html</a></p>
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		<title>By: Katie</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/#comment-55276</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Katie]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 May 2008 02:44:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.wordpress.com/?p=1419#comment-55276</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Delurking to ask--does anyone know of any good streaming belly dance music sites? Reading all these comments and seeing these videos makes me want to dance like the fat fool I am, but i have no nice music to do it to.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Delurking to ask&#8211;does anyone know of any good streaming belly dance music sites? Reading all these comments and seeing these videos makes me want to dance like the fat fool I am, but i have no nice music to do it to.</p>
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		<title>By: Deborah Lipp</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/#comment-55162</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Deborah Lipp]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 May 2008 00:06:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.wordpress.com/?p=1419#comment-55162</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I think acknowledging the anti-fat aesthetic is important, and realizing you&#039;re dug into it in ways you didn&#039;t know. But it&#039;s also okay to acknowledge that visual art forms advantage and disadvantage different appearances. I think it could be okay in a perfect world for some dances to look better when thin people do them, and some dances to look better when fat people do them. 

Think of, say, the difference between Fred Astaire and Gene Kelly. Each adapted his dance style to his body type, so that Astaire played to lean lines, and Kelly to muscularity. Bellies work nicely with some moves, and long legs work nicely with some moves, and so on, and I don&#039;t think that&#039;s inherently anti-fat.

That said, SHIT I can&#039;t really see getting the balls to dance in public, although my son&#039;s dance teachers have often invited me to join the adult classes.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think acknowledging the anti-fat aesthetic is important, and realizing you&#8217;re dug into it in ways you didn&#8217;t know. But it&#8217;s also okay to acknowledge that visual art forms advantage and disadvantage different appearances. I think it could be okay in a perfect world for some dances to look better when thin people do them, and some dances to look better when fat people do them. </p>
<p>Think of, say, the difference between Fred Astaire and Gene Kelly. Each adapted his dance style to his body type, so that Astaire played to lean lines, and Kelly to muscularity. Bellies work nicely with some moves, and long legs work nicely with some moves, and so on, and I don&#8217;t think that&#8217;s inherently anti-fat.</p>
<p>That said, SHIT I can&#8217;t really see getting the balls to dance in public, although my son&#8217;s dance teachers have often invited me to join the adult classes.</p>
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		<title>By: Kristin</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/#comment-55008</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Kristin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2008 17:54:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.wordpress.com/?p=1419#comment-55008</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Car-  My big belly gets in the way of a lot of moves, too.  For child&#039;s pose, just open your legs to let your belly fall between them.  I have large breasts, too, so I have learned many modifications...the best thing that I have found to do is just let my body dictate the most comfortable way to modify a pose.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Car-  My big belly gets in the way of a lot of moves, too.  For child&#8217;s pose, just open your legs to let your belly fall between them.  I have large breasts, too, so I have learned many modifications&#8230;the best thing that I have found to do is just let my body dictate the most comfortable way to modify a pose.</p>
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		<title>By: Victoria</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/#comment-54972</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Victoria]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2008 14:15:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.wordpress.com/?p=1419#comment-54972</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hi Gemma! Small world, eh? :)

Yeah, belly-dance in the Middle East is quite a tangled web indeed.  There&#039;s a lot of mixed messages about who dances, who is allowed to dance for whom and when, how they&#039;re accepted by the general public, the standards of body shape, etc.  

But yeah, outside the public eye, belly dance (or at least its movements) encompasses a huge range of ages and shapes.  

Have you read any of Morocco&#039;s ethographic studies of belly dance?  She spent time with the Bedouin and Ghawazee to investigate the true origins of the dance in childbirth rituals and as a community dance -- it&#039;s fascinating!  http://www.casbahdance.org/ARTICLES1.htm

And thanks, Sherri, for the youtube link!  I&#039;ve had the biggest girlcrush on Isidora Bushkovski since I started dance, but I hadn&#039;t seen that one.  (And I&#039;d chime in, don&#039;t give up on dance!  Like viv said, you could try a dvd or just play music in your own home and dance your heart out!)

April_D, if Delilah is your dance grandmother (teacher&#039;s teacher, hee!), lucky you!!  I&#039;ve never seen her perform live, but I have one of her dvds, and WOW.  If you get a chance to take a class or even a seminar, do it!!  I&#039;m still daydreaming about going on one of her Hawaiian dance retreats.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Gemma! Small world, eh? :)</p>
<p>Yeah, belly-dance in the Middle East is quite a tangled web indeed.  There&#8217;s a lot of mixed messages about who dances, who is allowed to dance for whom and when, how they&#8217;re accepted by the general public, the standards of body shape, etc.  </p>
<p>But yeah, outside the public eye, belly dance (or at least its movements) encompasses a huge range of ages and shapes.  </p>
<p>Have you read any of Morocco&#8217;s ethographic studies of belly dance?  She spent time with the Bedouin and Ghawazee to investigate the true origins of the dance in childbirth rituals and as a community dance &#8212; it&#8217;s fascinating!  <a href="http://www.casbahdance.org/ARTICLES1.htm" rel="nofollow">http://www.casbahdance.org/ARTICLES1.htm</a></p>
<p>And thanks, Sherri, for the youtube link!  I&#8217;ve had the biggest girlcrush on Isidora Bushkovski since I started dance, but I hadn&#8217;t seen that one.  (And I&#8217;d chime in, don&#8217;t give up on dance!  Like viv said, you could try a dvd or just play music in your own home and dance your heart out!)</p>
<p>April_D, if Delilah is your dance grandmother (teacher&#8217;s teacher, hee!), lucky you!!  I&#8217;ve never seen her perform live, but I have one of her dvds, and WOW.  If you get a chance to take a class or even a seminar, do it!!  I&#8217;m still daydreaming about going on one of her Hawaiian dance retreats.</p>
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		<title>By: Gemma</title>
		<link>http://kateharding.net/2008/05/15/bring-in-the-noise-bring-in-the-fat/#comment-54951</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Gemma]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 May 2008 09:30:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kateharding.wordpress.com/?p=1419#comment-54951</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hey Victoria! *waves* :)

You&#039;re totally right, of course. I was actually just reading about the ban on belly-dancing in some Islamic states, which touched on that issue slightly. 

I think the issue comes down to public perception and appearance. If you think of all the elderly women out there who are still dancing, that leaves a huge range of varied body shapes to imagine gracefully stepping through the dance. But are those women necessarily in the public eye? Not really. 

Not to mention the fact that in some countries women will only dance for women, and photography or video of the event is banned.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey Victoria! *waves* :)</p>
<p>You&#8217;re totally right, of course. I was actually just reading about the ban on belly-dancing in some Islamic states, which touched on that issue slightly. </p>
<p>I think the issue comes down to public perception and appearance. If you think of all the elderly women out there who are still dancing, that leaves a huge range of varied body shapes to imagine gracefully stepping through the dance. But are those women necessarily in the public eye? Not really. </p>
<p>Not to mention the fact that in some countries women will only dance for women, and photography or video of the event is banned.</p>
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