So say 40.4% of people 18-24, according to The Brogan Survey. Asked to rank obesity, smoking, drugs and alcohol in order of perceived “greatest threat to public health,” most people overall (38%) put drug abuse first and obesity (30.8%) second. But among the youngsters, fat was ranked number one.
Even if you believe obesity is a major health crisis, the idea that it might be greater than smoking — let alone drugs or alcohol — is stunningly wrong, and the degree of that misperception should serve as evidence that the War on Fat is way the fuck out of control.
And I say this as a brutally addicted smoker. I love to smoke (or my brain thinks I love to smoke, anyway, which amounts to the same thing). I smoke, and I smoke a lot, even though I’m well aware of the devastating consequences — my mother died of a heart attack at 64, largely attributable to being a lifelong smoker. That’s the power of denial, right there.
But you know what? You don’t see me writing a blog called Smoky Prose, advocating for “smokers’ rights” or “tobacco acceptance.” You don’t see me arguing until I’m blue in the face that the health risks of smoking are overblown. You don’t see me complaining that cigarettes are taxed so heavily, I literally spend as much as the payment on a pretty decent car to smoke every month. I like that cigarettes are obscenely expensive, because it means a lot of teenagers can’t afford to start, and that’s a thought that makes me ecstatic. Did you know that very few people start smoking after the age of 18, and virtually no one does after the age of 24? That’s because, once you get past that window of being young and stupid enough to assume you’re invincible, and you won’t get addicted, there is no way a reasonable person can convince herself that smoking is anything but the WORLD’S DUMBEST FUCKING IDEA. (I started at 14 and was hooked on a pack a day at 17.) Unlike fat, smoking is both deadly and disgusting.
Smoking kills more than 400,000 Americans a year, and unlike the 300,000 obesity-related deaths statistic that has been debunked a zillion times, that’s not bullshit.
The risks of second-hand smoke aren’t complete bullshit, either. Smoking puts the people you love at risk, which is a horrible thought for a smoker — but again, there’s the power of denial. There is no such thing as second-hand fat.
Being fat does not put tumors on your lungs. Putting food in your mouth does not carry a risk of later having to have parts of your mouth removed. Being fat does not endanger the people around you. Being fat does not steal your breath. (Yes, being very fat can make breathing more difficult, but rarely portable-oxygen-tank difficult. And if you see a fat person with a portable oxygen tank, that person is probably an ex-smoker.) Contrary to popular opinion, being fat does not stop your heart.
Smoking fucking kills people — and in slow, excruciating ways. But 40% of 18-24-year-olds surveyed think fat people are a greater public health risk.
Hey there, mainstream media? JOKE’S OVER. Young people believe inhaling poison causes fewer problems than being fat. THIS IS NOT OKAY. And it’s your fucking fault for regurgitating press releases from Big Pharma and weight loss companies; for repeating “obesity kills” ad nauseam without citing any source; for utterly failing to fact-check what you publish about fat; for ignoring mountains of research demonstrating that fat is both far more benign and far less controllable than most people believe; for acting as if dangerously underweight, coke-addicted young women with eating disorders are the picture of “good health”; for quoting “obesity experts” whose only training is in PR, or whose funding comes directly from corporations with a tremendous financial interest in promoting weight loss; for reporting that the American Academy of Pediatricians admits there is no evidence that “childhood obesity interventions” work, then says we can’t wait for evidence, and not batting a goddamned eye; for continuing to call any research that says obesity does not kill and may even be prophylactic against certain diseases a “paradox” instead of the plain truth scientists have known about for decades; for choosing, at every possible opportunity, to exploit the public’s baseless fears instead of correcting them.
This is what you’ve wrought: a generation that believes fat is more dangerous than smoking. Nice fucking job.
(Cross-posted to Shakespeare’s Sister and Hoyden About Town)
Filed under: Fat
I smoke, it’s my choice to smoke. Everything is hazardous, disease is also related to genetics, it’s not restricted to products and ingredients; disease is a reaction to products.
A person can smoke, and exercise on a daily basis, and will live longer than a person who is so overweight they are bedridden. I think that the obesity issue is valid, in cases where people are morbidly obese (mind you, I’m not referring to people who can engage in all daily pursuits, but those you’ll see in medical documentaries, who die because they can’t actually stand up from their weight).
The key to most things in life is moderation. Drinking, smoking, eating to excess, to the point of obsession is not functional, not when it used as a behavioral modifier. People who weight300 to 400 pounds (and more) aren’t like that because of their metabolism being shonky, very few can blame their metabolism, they’re like that because they use food (and little exercise) as a crutch. I’ve never been 300 pounds, but I know this because I’m a terrible comfort eater, it’s been a problem throughout my life, and I do have to take responsibility for it. As for this being worse or better than other habits? It’s individual, and no real comparison can be made. Millions of people die from military weapons, but no one whines about that, and its something that can be controlled.
Anastasia, please.
I have acknowledged numerous times that being fat to the point of immobility is, obviously, a profound health risk. It’s also something that only affects a tiny percentage of the population. It’s disingenuous to hold up those relatively few people as evidence that fat is equal to smoking.
You have no idea how other people “use” food. Yes, some people compulsively overeat, some people binge eat — and some people end up very fat because they’ve been dieting since they were 7 years old. The fact that you are a “comfort eater” does not tell you, me, or anyone else one damned thing about the fat person next to you.
And yes, a real comparison can be made. Smoking has many incredibly severe health consequences. Being “obese” according to a BMI chart does not.
And what the fuck are you even talking about with “nobody whines about people dying from military weapons?” Yeah, there’s absolutely no antiwar movement, no one blogging about it every fucking day. I just don’t know where you’d go to find another person who’s upset about the war.
Anastasia, how many people are “so overweight that they are bedridden”? Do you have any idea how rare that is? Meanwhile, I work at the VA, I type the reports of many of these vets who are heavy lifelong smokers, I see them in the halls all the time. The results ain’t pretty. They are NOT rarities.
And how the hell do you know what someone’s “metabolism” is or isn’t without knowing their medical history? Many things can affect it — and yeah, smoking is one. It’s quite possible that the reason your “comfort eating” doesn’t have the impact on your waistline that it does on others’ is because you smoke. Yes, there are 300-400 pound people who are binge eaters. There are also many who are not. Quit making snap judgments of people you don’t know and don’t observe closely on a daily basis, please.
Congratulations, Kate, you’re starting to get your very own concern trolls now. You must be doing something right. This is such important reading, I think. People seem to be under the false impression that nobody smokes anymore and that therefore smoking isn’t a giant health issue. That’s one of the downsides of public bans, people get lulled into smugness.
Meowser, GMTA.
Haha, 300 pounds, the absolute limit of human weight! You’re totally bedridden once you hit 300 pounds! Someone should alert Big Moves.
I’ve weighed up to 320 pounds and still went to work, ran for the bus, climbed stairs–do you mean to tell me I could have just stayed in bed all that time? I’m 280 now and I’m supposed to go to the gym after work today. Fuck it. I’m just going to lie down in the middle of my office floor until someone can hoist me into a car and take me home to my bed so I can use some food as a crutch.
Anastasia do you have any idea what 300 pounds looks like? BEcause I will tell you right now, I weigh more than that.
THIS is what 300+ pounds looks like:
For the record, I have a history of disordered eating – simply not eating or consuming far fewer calories than one ought. I have, at various times in my life, not exercised at all and gone to the gym every day. I lead, at the moment, a moderately active lifestyle and I’m trying to eat AT LEAST 1500 calories a day because I’ve fallen back into some old bad habits.
Anastasia, I can only laugh at your simple and misguided way of coming to conclusions. Beccause you comfort eat, everyone must. Tell that to my metabolism that has been incredibly fucked up because of a lifetime of dieting.
Ah, crap, the image link didn’t show up.
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1269/542306380_7ebdcbdc6f.jpg?v=0
TR, rock… I was just saying to Laura that I hoped you would show up and say “this is what 300 lbs looks like.”
My bet is that next she will tell you that you are probably six feet tall.
To nip THAT in the bud, I am 5′3″! I can do 5′4″ if my posture is impeccable and my hair is fluffy. *grin*
I wanted to whip out that photo I originally posted in Fatshionista but I think mostly naked 300 pound happy chicks might be too much for Anastasia to process.
I was just saying to Laura that I hoped you would show up and say “this is what 300 lbs looks like.”
I was counting on it, in fact. :)
Oh, and Jane, I love you.
I wanted to whip out that photo I originally posted in Fatshionista but I think mostly naked 300 pound happy chicks might be too much for Anastasia to process.
And I was so hoping it would be that one when I clicked!
Kate, you know I only post this because I love you.
http://static.flickr.com/93/280712730_496cc28881.jpg?v=0
NSFW! Mostly naked fat chick!
Man, it’s a good thing I gave up political ambitions a long time ago.
Thank you! Yippee for hot, happy, mostly naked fat chicks!!!!
And LOL about the poltical ambitions. It’s also a good thing I gave up on ever teaching minors.
I totally already taught minors. Here’s hoping they don’t google me to see what their old teacher is up to!
Kate, congratulations – you’ve made it.
Great post, too. I believe this one puts a bullethole through one of the Fat Hate Bingo squares, does it not?
I find it odd how weight bigots can compare obesity to smoking, but fat hatred cannot somehow be compared to racism. It makes no sense to me.
For my part, Jon, it is that there is no hierarchy of oppression. You can’t say with any degree of authority that one is worse than the other because they ALL suck. They all are horrible. They all have negative effects that are untold.
But people who hate fat don’t play by those same rules.
Thank goodness at 19 I’m not one of those young people that thinks fat is a greater threat than drug abuse.
Kate, meowser, TR? The three of you are slayin’ me today!
Forget smokes, I’m addicted to you guys!!
Seriously, Kate? Thank you for this post.
Perceptions of weight are a weird thing, aren’t they? For some reason there’s this perception that over 120-135 pounds for a woman is fat, regardless of height or build. And any woman over 200 must be gigantic, once again, regardless of height or build. Which is only perpetuated by all women (even the very slim ones!) taking 10-15 pounds off their weight. It’s a strange thing. And for the record, I had no idea that’s what 300 pounds looked like either… good to know =)
This is a beautiful post, and I think I don’t have anything to add to the comments that you lovely ladies haven’t already added.
Oh, yes, I do. My sister is tall and thin. To stand us side-by-side, most people would suggest that she’s healthier. But the reality is that while she smokes, drinks several cokes a day, regularly drinks alcohol, and doesn’t exercise. I’m the complete opposite in habits. It’s incredibly frustrating to believe that people would automatically think she’s healthy based on appearance.
Gotta love that juxtaposition. “But what about the people who are too fat to stand! (you know, like 300lbs)” Some people really just have no clue what being fat is like. What it look likes, what it means. This goes back to the thermodynamicals who are certain that weighing 300lbs means eating 6000 calories a day at least and thus they think everything is so simple. Some offer tough love, while others offer condesending platitudes where they cheritably assume we are merely addicts instead of reckless. Its all a joke.
I’ll probably butcher this statistic, but I think it comes from Fat!So? somewhere. Wann was noting the risks associated with fatness were usually something like 2 times the risk of not being fat. The risk of lung cancer in smoker, though, is something like 3,000 times the risk in non-smokers. Sure, both are correlations, not causations, but they sure as heck don’t mean the same thing. Yet one is increasingly seen as much more dangerous, but its the wrong one.
Glad to provide a visual, roses and alison!
roses (and others), you may be interested in these weight-guessing poll results. Fatties are underrepresented but it’s an interesting example of what constant weight misrepresentation does to people’s perceptions even of smaller folks. (Somewhere there is also a chart showing real people for different height/weight combinations, but I don’t have it bookmarked here.)
Particularly interesting in those poll results: look for the set of three photos of the same woman, one in a bathing suit, one in a flannel shirt, and one dressed to go out, and check out the difference in guesses!
Jess, I have the link right here!
http://www.cockeyed.com/photos/bodies/heightweight.shtml
It’s still lacking a lot of images.
So Kate, as a smoker maybe you’ve got a rejoinder for a sitch like this. I once called out some fat-concern-trolling online, noting that the basher was a smoker and thus really didn’t have a moral high ground to bash the fatties based on health. The basher said (paraphrasing), “At least I know smoking is bad for me, and you shouldn’t start, at least I’m not pretending I’m perfectly healthy.” What would you say to something like that? Frankly I’m stumped much of the time when arguing with lawyers (which this basher was).
Personally, Meowser, I’d avoid the dilemma by not going to the “Yeah, but you’re a smoker” card. Its tough, because gosh knows it makes sense, but it just gives them an opening like this where they can reclaim the moral high ground so dishonestly. Sure, they insist that they know smoking is bad for them which supposedly makes them better people, but surely they are not advocating the viciously hostile treatment of themselves that they are urging for fat people. When a person just won’t concede a double standard, though, they’ll have a rationalization of why they are different and it will change every time you call them out on it.
I wish that there was a way to put my picture up here, now that would scare the crap out of our first poster. I am more than 300 pounds and I am certainly not bedridden. I fly too. I don’t buy a second seat, I am nice, I don’t binge eat, but I do eat well, I am loved by a man, I am married to a man who loves and respects me, and it is for more than just my brains!, I do dress nice, I don’t smell, I travel to fabulous places, and not just in my head, and we are trying to have a child. Damn, now that is a full life. Not an empty existance for a fat chick!
Huh. I started smoking at 35. Go figure.
PS — Great post!!! And thanks, Anastasia, for the timely illustration of Kate’s point.
Alphabitch? Dumbest fucking idea in the world. :)
I write that with a lit ciggy in my hand.
And thanks.
It’s kind of embarrassing. But it wasn’t until I moved to Winston-Salem, North Carolina that I really even tried to smoke. And as I do the math, I realize I was not quite 35, but close. Old enough to know better, certainly.
Who knew it’d be so much fun? My favorite cigarette of all? The one I smoke right after a bike ride or a run. I used to cycle to work every day and people would see me there all sweaty and slamming down a bottle of water and then lighting an unfiltered cigarette and they’d get all in my face about how I was un-doing every good thing I’d accomplished by riding my bike. I’d just laugh at them and say I was trying to keep in shape to breathe all their stinky car exhaust while riding.
But I started taking that new nicotine-receptor blocking drug yesterday, on accounta my workplace is becoming a tobacco-free campus on Monday or something. But the thing is, I don’t really want to quit all that badly — I just want to not spend all day thinking about when and where I can have my next cigarette. We’ll see how it works. I promised myself a new MacBook if I can quit for real.
Rebecca – I say go for it. Mine pics are just up as flickr links but people who want to see will certainly look.
Jess, thanks, that was fascinating!
I was just over at the survey website, and found it interesting that the results were from here in North Carolina. I wonder if that had any effect at all in the downplaying of the risks of tobacco. I wouldn’t say that folks here think tobacco is harmless — not by a long shot, but it’s way more acceptable here than elsewhere I’ve lived. Even so, however, I’d think that young people would be more likely to think tobacco use is extremely harmful, not less.
Interesting.
You are right “The Rotund.” They constantly pick and choose things to add to their point.
They’ll say that lifestyle has a greater effect on weight, but in regards to sexual preference: We were BORN to like thin partners. :P
Oh right… I so love trying to refute a point that keeps mutating everytime I bring a different argument. :P
Isn’t avoidance a defense mechanism? :P
TR, thanks for the pictures… so pretty!
Awesome post, awesomer comments convention.
On the (Off-Topic) topic of people’s mixed-up perceptions of what X lb.s actually looks like, I just came across an interesting project-in-progress at Cockeyed.com. Rob Cockerham is collecting reader-donated photos of people of all sizes and positioning them along a height/weight graph. A sample page is already up.
I don’t know where he’s going with this, but Rob’s projects are usually fun and funny as well as thought-provoking. And the images made me think of Joy Nash’s “Fat Rant” call to tell people what you really weigh.
I’ll never grok my father, smoking like a chimney as he carried around his oxygen tank, and drinking like a fish complaining that he needed to “cut his carbs.” He didn’t really appreciate my pointing out that his weight was the least of his problems, or that alcohol is 100% carbs.
He did actually set his face on fire about 8 months before he died. He was so drunk that he couldn’t get the flaming canula off his face. Had I not been sitting next to him, he would have burned his throat and lungs as well as his face. He probably would also have died from the house’s burning down around him.
Hey, Swellanor – looks like we were all on the same page. That is the exact project we linked to earlier in the thread. Isn’t it awesome?
Oops! I should read and click more thoroughly before commenting! Sorry about that.
I found the page while reading something hi-larious on Cockeyed.com. It is, definitely, awesome.
One bad side effect of kids thinking that fat is so dangerous… teens (girls especially) will smoke because they have heard it makes them thin. Several of my college friends smoked because they were convinced it kept them thin. Girls have been doing that for ages, but now if they actually think fat is more unhealthy than smoking, they may think they actually have a health justification for smoking to lose weight. That’s terrible – I don’t want anyone to think smoking is better for them than the alternative!
I estimate I weigh about 270 lbs, and am 5′1″, so I’m proportionally about the same size as The Rotund – and I still sometimes have this idea flash in my head, often when caught in mirror-dazzle in department stores, that I am this gargantuan beast of horror (thanks, society) and I try to catch my head and tell it to snap the fuck out of that kind of thinking. I remember I’ve seen pictures like The Rotund just posted, and fat people walking down the street or in the mall or wherever I and think ‘Hey, that person looks pretty snappy’ – and I then think ‘Waitaminute, I look like that, why the hell do I think I am not awesome?’
300lbs = bedridden? I almost snorted coffee onto my monitor. On the Big Ballet site there’s a picture of a ballerina who probably weighs that much dancing ON POINTE.
It’s things like this that make people me feel guilty for ever being hungry and for wanting the hunger to go away by eating something.
You know, I always assumed fat was worse than smoking, because nobody ever shouted at me from a car whenever I was out in public with a cigarette in my hand. Whereas when I’d walk down the street at my highest weight I’d hear from plenty of
douchebagshealth-concerned citizens.Wendy, no shit.
I think this survey is a really good example of how people SUCK at estimating risks. In large part this is due to the “availability” heuristic, where people weigh risk greater in things they can remember more easily. (Plane crashes, versus car crashes, plane crashes are much more visible, and so people remember them more.)
Fat, obviously, gets talked about all the time in the media. But I also wonder if people’s perception of it has to do with it also being a personal issue for them. (Totally talking out of my ass.)
Personally I’m 6′ and I weigh around 300 pounds. I’m certainly not bedridden. People are dumb.
Re-read your post using “fat” for “smoker,” with it’s emotional hysteria and claims of death counts and deadliness, anecdotal evidence and unsupportable, exagerrations. It does not lend credibility and I find it an embarrassment to our movement.
Instead of getting in line behind a culture that denegrates anyone not doing something that isn’t seen as politically correct or “healthy” behavior, it is important to recognize that smokers and fat people are both being persecuted in much the same ways, led by the same organizations, and using remarkably similar bad science. Watch what is happening to smokers because that will soon be fat people — employment, healthcare, etc. Smoker organizations are actually far more sympathetic and supportive of fat people’s rights and against size discrimination than the fat community is there for them. You might be surprised to find that much of the “science” being used to claim “second-hand smoke is deadly” is every bit as bogus as that being used to claim “fat is deadly.”
You accuse others of exploiting the public’s baseless fears about fat, while you do the same thing with smoking, while screaming with disgust because you find smokers so repugnant. Hardly an example of acceptance of diversity and those who may choose to have different lifestyles than you approve of.
Check out a doctor who is deciphering the science at:
http://tobaccoanalysis.blogspot.com/
Rene, since I’m not a part of your movement, I’m not that concerned about embarrassing it.
I do not find smokers repugnant; I am one. I find tobacco companies repugnant, and smoking kind of gross in theory, except for the part where I do it about 20 times a day.
As I said in response to you at Shakes, if even half of what we’re told about smoking is true, the negative health effects are still orders of magnitude greater than the negative effects of fat. That was the point of this post.
I’m also aware that “second-hand smoke is deadly” is almost certainly overstating the matter — hence my choice of “not complete bullshit” vs. “not bullshit” — but when we’re talking about hurting people I love, ANY risk is not really okay with me. Nor is triggering other people’s asthma and allergies, making colds worse, etc., for that matter.
And really, for as much of a skeptic as I am, I have trouble buying that there’s a parallel here in terms of reporting about the health risks. It’s a cui bono? thing. Tobacco companies profit if you convince people that smoking’s not dangerous. Weight loss companies and big pharma profit if you convince people that fat IS dangerous. See the difference there?
I completely agree that the war on smoking is exactly where the war on fat is going, and I’ve written about that before. It disturbs the hell out of me. From a civil liberties standpoint, things like cities banning smoking in cars scares me.
But it all comes down to this: I don’t smoke because I feel like it. It is the OPPOSITE of a personal freedom issue. I smoke because I am an addict. I smoke because I feel like I cannot stop. I smoke because when I try to quit, I end up crying in a heap on the floor, unable to function in my daily life. I smoke because I am, for all intents and purposes, not free to choose; when I try to quit, merely keeping my head above water becomes a full-time job.
And there are big corporations profiting from my lack of personal freedom and bodily autonomy. That pisses me right off, and THAT is why I have no interest in your movement.
False analogy to say that “tobacco companies profit…”
Big pharma profits off convincing people fat is dangerous.
Big pharma profits off convincing people second hand smoke is dangerous.
Follow the money and the money behind tobacco cessation interests — they’re the same ones selling weight loss.
By “movement” I was referring to size acceptance — interesting that you don’t see yourself as part of that.
By “movement” I was referring to size acceptance — interesting that you don’t see yourself as part of that
Oh, zing, Rene!
Please.
The Rotund @14 – you look like me.
No, seriously. I’m 5′2″, I have no idea what I weigh (the last time I weighed myself was over seven years ago, and I think I was about 100kg then, so about 220lb-ish) and I wear clothes which are Australian size 22 – 24 (generally 24). But the general body shape is similar, and the shot of you in your underwear looks a lot like I do in mine. I have a partner (of 10 years now) who tells me that my body type is “boofuls” (suits me!).
When I tell people I’m size 24, I’ve had them say I must be wrong (which generally earns them a Look – I have this Thing about being told I’m wrong when I know I’m Right). I’m told I carry my weight well, which presumably means I look thinner than I wind up weighing. I just figure it’s the result of generations of peasant ancestors – I store fat well, I lose it reluctantly, and I spent ten years dieting, which educated my metabolism that I’m in an area with permanent famines (and knocked my thyroid out of whack to boot). I’m solid, I’m strong for my size and lack of fitness, and I’m gifted with a fair amount of endurance. I figure I have the genes to carry the weight… and even if I don’t, I’ve had three grandparents survive past ninety. I think I’m likely to get a pretty good innings, provided I’m careful doing things like crossing the street, and steering clear of weight loss centres.
“Food as a crutch”?! How about “as a necessary part of being alive”? Some people seem to think that eating at ALL is a bad thing to do, I swear.
Guess what? I had dinner today. AND I ENJOYED IT. SO THERE.
[...] can’t stop thinking about this entry of Kate’s. A large percentage of 18-24 year olds believe that being fat is more unhealthy than drug abuse, [...]
[...] can’t stop thinking about this entry of Kate’s. A large percentage of 18-24 year olds believe that being fat is more unhealthy than drug abuse, [...]
[...] can’t stop thinking about this entry of Kate’s. A large percentage of 18-24 year olds believe that being fat is more unhealthy than drug abuse, [...]
Really nice post – thanx for sharing